CYLINDER HEAD INFO gathered by DJOHAGIN

Ford B-460 Bastard Head Flow Numbers

Courtesy of Charlie Evans

Stage 8, 17* head. Flowed tested in April of 2002.

2.380" intake valve, 1.880" exhaust valve.

.200=159/130
.300=250/178
.400=335/226
.500=405/272
.600=447/313
.700=473/338
.800=484/353
.850=487/358
.900=490/363

Ford E-Heads

General Information

Courtesy of Randy Malik

The "E's" can only be bought bare when new; the seats and guides are in a seperate bag.
They have a completely different chamber and I think the valve angles mimmik the DRCE Olds head.
They also have their own distinct head bolt pattern.

The Blue Thunder "THOR" head is a cross between the "C" and "E" head designs.

Courtesy of Charlie Evans

I have worked with the E-460 heads some. They flow better than the C-460 heads, as they should, because they are the Ford Pro Stock head. Of course part of the reason is because of the steeper valve angles used in these high end, high lift heads.

As Randy said, they have a different and specific bolt pattern, intended for the short deck Pro Stock blocks. I'm sure that a person could redrill either blocks, heads, or both, in order to make everything work on a A-460 block, but to me that seems like a lot of trouble.

If you want to step up from a C-460 head, to a better/bigger wedge design head, and still use a conventional bolt pattern block, then there is two choices. Either the Profiler #205 heads, or the B.T. Thor heads. I've done a few sets of Profiler heads, and I'm really liking them. They have a 420 cc intake port, and the flow numbers I'm getting out of them are better (IMO), than the flow numbers I'm seeing posted for either the 408 cc Thor head, or the 440 cc Thor head. I'd say they are in between the 440 cc Thor head and the 470 cc Thor head, but yet they're still a smaller 420 cc port.

E-460 Exhaust Flange Angle

The exhaust flange is 90 degrees to the deck surface

E-Head Flow Numbers

Courtesy of Charlie Evans

These are intake flow numbers from our flow bench and were flowed back during the late summer of 2007.

Set # 1

2.520" intake valve, on a 4.625" bore

.300=248
.400=340
.500=417
.600=483
.700=521
.800=540
.850=548
.900=550
.950=552
1.00=557

Set # 2

2.520" intake valve, on a 4.625" bore

.300=240
.400=325
.500=408
.600=481
.700=525
.800=555
.850=564
.900=571
.950=573
1.00=571

Hemi Heads

History On The Hemi Heads

Courtesy of Alan Root

Ford produced the original hemi heads in 1969 and 1970.

Alan Root did the orginal A-441 hemi heads between 1983 and 1995. These heads the same exact valve angles as the original Ford Boss head from 1969. There was basically only one version of that.

The originally developed new version of the hemi head incorporated provisions to accomodate an 18 head bolt pattern. Some of the early heads actually had the 18 head bolt pattern, but the part evolved and it was determined they weren't necessary.

Nick Arias and Alan Root were partners for a couple of years in Arias Root Engineering, dba AR Inc. Nick Arias owned a pattern shop that developed his casting tooling for his numerous projects. Tom Roberts was Nick Arias's head pattern maker. Tom Roberts later left Nick Arias and started his own shop.

After Alan Root bought out Nick Arias interest in AR Inc., Nick Arias had Tom Roberts duplicate all of the tooling for the Boss 429 engine.

By 1986 there were two identical sets of tools to cast Boss 429 engines. One was owned by Alan Root and one owned by Nick Arias. Nick Arias later sold his patterns to Chuck Seyler who then sold them to Carroll Carter. Alan Root patterns were sold to Trick Flow in 1995. Alan Root is no longer involved in the manufacture of any of the AR/Arias style hemi heads or blocks.

Ford hasn't carried the B-441 hemi heads for years now nor any of the hemi heads for that matter. Ed Lyons was the last advocate for the hemi heads, and when he left, the program went out the door.

In 1996, Tom Roberts did 3 new versions of the head:

The B-441-A was intended for use in NHRA Pro-Stock. Bob Glidden was actually involved with Tom Roberts in the development of that part.

The B-441-B head was designed to be a 4.900" bore center head for large displacement engines (700 CID and up).

The B-441-C head was the 5.000" bore center part intended for use in IHRA Pro-Stock.

The parts were cast in the greater Los Angeles area and were machined at Alan Root's facility. Tom Roberts sold his patterns to Carroll Carter, dba C & C.

The "street" hemi heads C & C has are based on the orginal AR Inc. parts made in the 80's and 90's. The heads are cast and machined in the Los Angeles area. Alan Root is involved with machining the heads.

The new race heads C & C has had some port changes.

Anything Boss 429 related can be purchased from C & C directly. C & C has the components that used to be available through RDI.

Link history was taken from: http://www.network54.com/Forum/threa...eid=1122351258

High Flow Dynamics Aluminum Pentroof Hemi Heads

Courtesy of Paul Kane

I just wish to clarify that the cylinder head package offered through High Flow Dynamics is not a copy / replica / recreation, etc. of the Boss 429 head or any other hemi head on the market for the Ford. Ours is a unique design unto itself for the 429/460, and has absolutely no parts interchangeability with any of the other Ford hemi head manufactures, whether they be OEM or aftermarket.



These heads are not something to be compared to such as an A460 head, EX514, etc., but are more along the lines of Alan Johnson, Keith Black or Bran Anderson-ish drag racing heads. This is not a water jacketed head (was never intended to be), although we are evaluating the feasibility of adding this feature. At this time, there have been produced only in billet form, although we now have a pattern that we feel is in it's final adjustment and will enable casting production, should we move that direction. These heads don't have the Boss 429 oiling like most of the other Boss-style hemi heads (which make the heads more suitable for the C9AE Boss 429 block only). Instead, they are designed around / meant to fit the 429/460 passenger car blocks as well as the A460 blocks, Eliminator, etc.

Note the following features:
injection nozzles at the intake bowls
the rocker shaft design.
8 plug head
Head is 6061 and the rockers are 7075.
Oiling is through the shafts via the pressure feed at the rear of the block.
Standard oil drainback

Jon Kasse Hemi Heads

Courtesy of Jon Kaase

Well, after the seminar, it's safe to say the word's out. We are indeed making original type Boss 429 heads, manifolds, valve covers and rockers.

This project started in October, but I have a 30 year history with these engines and the street/NASCAR head shortcommings. By the end of my 600 mile trip home from the Enginemasters, I had a solid plan for fixing all the problems with these parts. When I found how much the stock heads were selling for, I was even more determined to go through with this venture.

As of now, we have done all the improvements to the heads as well as dyno testing. The patterns for casting are in the works and at the halfway point. We have a running single plane manifold finished and it will follow the head at the pattern shop. After that, the valve covers.

We are trying to make the heads stronger and more user friendly. The biggest problem with the original boss 429 heads, is the strength and design of the casting. If you were to cut one in half, you wouldn't believe it. The deck is real thin, as is the chamber. We used to race these engines and the heads would stand no abuse at all. A little detonation and it would push the chambers in so bad that there would be light showing through the exhaust seats, and wouldn't even start again.

We are designing a stronger casting that is much thicker. It looks as close to the stock head as we can make it. The stock porting wasn't that bad. It just needed a few tune ups here and there. The exhaust port is a little smaller than a stock port. The intake is about the same voulme. The entry is the stock size, the bowl smaller and the short turn is bigger. I have no way of knowing how much more power these heads make over completely stock. Just guessing, maybe 50 to 75 on a 460-514 engine.
The new heads will fit on a stock 429-460 block with wedge type head gaskets and oil drains. We have designed our own rockers for these heads. They fit under the stock valve covers, and will be much cheaper than any of the aftermarket boss rockers out there.

Here are some of the improvements we've made:

1) The deck is much thicker, typical of a modern race head
2) This head will be able to use a Fel-Pro 1018 stock, unmodified head gasket or similar wedge 460 gasket
3) The head will fit any stock, unmodified 429-460 block. it uses the stock wedge oil drain holes. It oils the rockers through the pushrods.
4) The chambers are filled in for about 79-80 cc's. This will give us 10:1-11:1 with a flat top piston in a 466/521". (stock heads need a dome for any type of compression)
5) The heads look exactly like the stock heads from the outside.
6) The porting is far better than the stock heads.
7) They use .250" long, 11/32", BBC valves.
8 ) We are making rockers that improve the geometry and allow for no block grinding. (For exhaust pushrod clearance)
9) The valve covers look exactly like stock.
10) The header and intake manifold layout and interchange is exactly stock.

This is the street head that I welded up and have been testing with. We polished it up for the seminar last weekend. It is on the engine now and should run tomorrow.

At this point, our 466" ( the one that was on the cover of Enginemasters Magazine with P-51 heads) made 801 HP. this was with 9.8:1 compression, and 256 degree roller cam. We will be running these heads on our 521" motor by Tues. It has 10.9:1 and a little more cam. That engine always makes 800-810HP with the P-51, 750-770HP with Ford's SCJ's. I will be posting dyno results at night.

Kaase/Boss 429 head test #1

I had hoped to run our 521" test motor with the prototype Boss 429 heads today. We had a setback and had to wait for parts. The stock truck rods we've been running since 2000 finally are starting to scare me. I noticed yesterday that the deck clearance looked tilted. A quick check showed .020" tilt from front to rear of the flat top piston. We disassembled it and put the rods on a Sullen alignment gage. They were indeed bent (pin end bent sideways). I guess 7 years of 800HP could do that. I'm trying to find a set of Eagle or Scat 2 1/2" bearing, 6.605" rods in the Atlanta area now. If we can find some in the morning (Summit or BCI) we may have it running tomorrow night. Since the 466 made 801HP with 9.8 compression, I have high hopes for the 521 with 10.9. I plan to try a hydraulic roller in this engine later. I also am making another single plane intake, only lower carb height. We also have a stock street manifold to try.

All the rockers are different than the stock rockers. I looked real hard at making repo rockers and machining the heads just like stock, but the stock stuff really blows and I didn't want to follow the old design. I don't like offsets if at all possible, espically with narrow bushings or rollers.

The intake we will be using is a 1.650" pivot length. Stock is much shorter, which as you know plays havoc with high lift and valve bounce. We used to race the stock NASCAR rockers and the seat wear was unreal. When we went to Jesels, the seat wear went away. Also, the exhaust rockers are longer, to help with getting the ex. pushrod away from the deck and head gasket. That wouldn't be so bad; you could grind notches in the block and gasket for the pushrod, but there are 2 water holes in the deck that come within 1/8" of the finish grind mark. You know there would be trouble with this. So we engineered the exhaust rockers to be more fool proof, and not require any grinding on the block.

Kaase/Boss 429 head test #2

We didn't quite get it running tonight. We did get it together and pushed into the dyno room. We found a set of Eagle rods at BCI in Atlanta. I should add that they were much cheaper than Summit's price, a few miles south. I had to bush them down for .990 pins. I hope to run it a lot tomorrow.

Kaase/Boss 429 head test #3

Link to dyno results: http://www.460ford.com/viewtopic.php?t=20447

On the long test (2500 to 6600), I stopped before peak power. That was an Enginemasters test. After the Enginemasters, I have no fear of choking one down to 2500. You can see it still has pretty good poop down low. If it were a real Enginemasters entry, it would have 15 degrees less cam.

Specs:

block--------------stock 460
bore---------------4.390
stroke-------------4.300
crank--------------cast iron Motorsport, 2.500" rods
rods---------------eagle CRS 6605 F3D
pistons-------------Diamond flat top
compression------10.9
head cc------------84
carb----------------BG king Demon 1150
cam----------------Comp Roller 273-280 110* .457 lobe

This is the same old short block we have been testing with since 2000. We even did all the original SCJ prototype head testing with it. The heads are our prototype Boss Hemi that we are going to be making. Pix on other thread. It has the same valve spring that we install on the P-51 roller heads. (Manley 221243 dual, 1.550") Same retainers also (steel Comp) We ran it to 7500 with no problem.

We are changing the cam to a Comp hyd. roller for tomorrow. It's a 246* , 110CL .360 lobe .595 lift.

You can usually figure losing about 10 HP on the 600 vs 300 sweep.

The P-51's made a best of 810, Ford Motorsport SCJ's made 775, and the hemi's made 910. All on the same block with the same cam. The hemi did have different pistons. All were about 10.9 compression.

Kaase/Boss head test #4

Link to dyno results: http://www.460ford.com/viewtopic.php?t=20482

We had a little trouble trying the Hyd. Roller cam. This is the first dyno run. The next was 20 worse. Didn't know why. Then I started it off at 2500. The low numbers were real good, 600 ft lbs by 3100rpm. Upper numbers were 50 worse. A check of the valve train revealed one exhaust rocker that had about .400 lash. The hyd lifter was collapsed all the way and stuck there. It had quite a bit of valve spring pressure, went to 6900 before float. One other thing it could have been. That side has lifter bushings with .025" oil holes. May have been restricted too much. We have seen times when this much spring pressure turned more rpm but hurt the power 20 all the way up. Next time we run this hyd roller, I will use weaker beehive springs and open up the oil holes to the lifters. We changed the cam back to the original roller and I am working on the intake manifold to run tomorrow. The Hyd roller cam was a Comp. 248-254, .360/.345, 110cl. .620"-.595"
.
Kaase/Boss head test #5

Link to dyno results: http://www.460ford.com/viewtopic.php?t=20520

Today the 521 was tested again with the 273-280 cam and intake manifold work. The cam was installed 4* ahead of the first tests. The intake manifold is the prototype that was used in all testing. The difference today was I reduced the exit size of the ports. They were ported to aprox. 2.300" round, like the head port. Last night I epoxied them up and today re-ported them to 2.125" round. The epoxy tapers to 0 about 2" in. The engine had about 10 ft/lbs more TQ, peak power was about the same. I ran it low (2500-6500) and it was a little better than test #3.

Kaase/Boss head test#6

Link to dyno results: http://www.460ford.com/viewtopic.php?t=22965

I have been doing lots of testing with the Boss headed 521". Mostly cam & manifold work. It usually makes 890-905HP @ 7000. This weekend we built up a 429" short block. (I was balancing the crank and honing the block yesterday morning) The chambers were bigger than I remembered, 90cc. So the 521 was really at 10.4 compression, not 10.9. The 429 needed a .080" flat dome to get 10.4.
This engine has a stock 429 cast crank, .010-.010, stock 2-bolt block, a Comp 252-252@ .050 solid roller cam, and our prototype Boss Hemi heads and intake. We used Eagle 6.605 rods and Diamond pistons with 1/16, 1/16, and 3/16 rings.
I have never dyno tested a 429 sized engine. I figured with the 3.59" stroke it would be pretty lame down low.

I don't have the dyno sheets here at home, so this is what I remember.
Peak torque was around 630 Ft/Lbs. It would take a load at 2400 with no problem. I don't think it was ever under 500 Ft/Lbs. Imagine how good it would be with 20 degrees more cam and 2 points of compression.
This is a really fun project to work on. I like the fact that it will make great power with very little camshaft. It has plenty of bottom end, no matter what size stroke is in it. All the testing done to this
point has been with streetable compression. (10.4 Max)
Next week I will be testing different valve sizes. Right now we are at 2.300 and 1.900.

Kaase/Boss head test#7

One of my life's dreams is to be able to come in to work on the weekend and dyno this boss 429, and no one can tell me I can't. No phone, no people, no rules, no set plan. Just try whatever comes to mind.
Most of the testing has been done with either a 521", or just this week, a 429 + .030, or 435". It seems that both sizes respond the same to whatever parts we try on them. The only difference in the two engines is the stroke, 3.59 vs. 4.3.
The best power for the 435 is 780 Hp, the 521 has 900HP. This weekend with the 435, I tried manifolds. We borrowed a NASCAR spyder type, single plane. With the same 4500 carb, it made a best of 700 HP @ 6500. 600 ft/lbs @ 5500. It was a little worse all the way from 2500 than our homemade prototype manifold. It is after all, 38 years old. Then I tried a stock passenger car intake, dual plane. It had to have a 850 carb, 4150 style with no spacer. The intake has 4 holes and no communication between sides. It made a best of 658@ 6500, 577 ft/lbs @ 5000. The numbers below 4000 RPM were better than the NASCAR intake, and mostly better than our intake.
With this combo of parts, the only thing different than a stock Boss 429 street engine, is the cam (252-252, .700"), and the head porting. I've always been told that the street cars didn't perform very well. I don't know what was holding them back, but I believe this one would kick ass!

How do these heads compare with the A-460/ TFS? I think on most size engines, they would be a little better. Our 521 with 10.4 compression makes 900. A 521 with A-460 heads will make 900+, but I'm not sure it would with low compression and a 268/273 cam. We built a 600", TFS ,all new with 14 to 1, 288/300 cam CNC ported heads. All first class parts. It made 1030HP. We will be building a 600" for testing our heads and intake soon. I think it will make 1000 with street compression. We'll see.
One good thing is that the Boss carb height would be lower than the A-460 with the newer Trick Flow manifold. Also, with the newer A-460 manifold, it almost won't take a load down low. You would not be too impressed with any street action at the lower rpm's.

The 429 made 780 on the first hit. That is with the 252-252 roller. 106 lobe center, .430" lobe lift with 1.75 rockers. The same cam in the 521 took it from 900 to 837. Below 6000, it was the same or better. We had been running a 269-273, 107, .457" lobe in the 521. I never ran the bigger cam in the 429. The dual plane intake was from a stock boss 429 street car.

Boss 429 Replacement Cylinder Head

We (IDT) are a distributor for the Boss 429 cylinder head that was displayed at the Columbus swap meet. Awhile ago, we began developing a relationship with the person who built the cylinder head tooling. At the same time I knew that there were other people in the Detroit area that were working on other Boss 429 hardware including Eric, which many of you know. The group of us sat down and agreed to work together on compatible hardware. The cylinder head has been updated with improvements in casting, machining and hardware. Currently the intake and exhaust ports are similar to the production design. Newer castings will be available with revised intake, exhaust ports and combustion chambers. In the future, the heads will be available with CNC ports and chambers. The current design cylinder heads have a 2.400" intake valve and a 1.900" exhaust valve. The head is machined for rocker shaft oiling which will work with Eric's rocker arm. T&D also offers a roller Boss 429 rocker arm that oils the rocker arm through the center of the push rod. The cylinder head is not machined for "O" rings so a conventional head gasket can be used. The head can ordered machined for "O" rings.

The Boss 429 Replacement Cylinder head stock is stock looking in appearance. The factory production casting issues have been corrected (i.e. combustion chamber, spring seats, and wall thicknesses). Currently cylinder heads are being machined with all factory machining features. This includes the oil hole gun drilling that feeds the rocker arms as the original Boss 429 cylinder head. Eric from Diamond (EFD) in a previous post discussed his rocker arm which will fit these cylinder heads. By mid summer a CNCed port and chamber head will be available. Currently the cylinder head is set up for a 2.400" intake valve; 1.900" exhaust valve. These cylinder heads can be ordered through Eric (EFD), ET Performance and IDT.

The head seen at the 2008 spring Columbus meet is a head that is an exact replica of the original Boss 429 casting, but with many improvements.

1. much thicker decks and chambers, which are reinforced inside casting.
2. No "O" rings - can use modern head gaskets
3. Thicker bolt bosses' in the casting (no cracking when you tq the head bolts)
4. 1pc. bronze 11/32 giudes, that are machined concentric to the valve seats (the factory ones weren't)
5. Larger spring cup/pad o.d. for 1.625" springs
6. Quench style chamber - blended and radiused in casting - no machined chambers
7. Factory oiling of the rockerarms (can use OEM forged pieces if you have them)
8. Uses factory or repro valve cover
9. Oil drainbacks are in factory Boss location - installation on to a wedge or truck block will require extrenal drainbacks, and pressure oil lines from the valley to oil the rockers thru the head. (done it dozens of times)
10. Fully CNC machined - seats & giudes installed

Since the IDT guys have nicely leaked my rocker project to the forum, I'm posting pics of what my new rockers will look like, so that all can see. This has been a real undertaking to get them to this point, but I am really proud of them, and I hope they are well receiced. Would like feedback from all who care to, as I am just about ready to go to the foundry and have the first run made. Any mistakes or huge issues need to be caught now, not after they're made....so I'm listening, and now's your chance to chime in.

As far as the rockers go, I, Eric, just finished an actual mock-up of the sample rockers on a real engine, to plot actual valve lift vs. lobe lift, and verify the rockers' ratios. What I found was pretty amazing.

The ratios come out at 1:75 for both rockers at max lift, (as I planned) but tracking actual valve lift every 10 degrees from zero lobe lift, to max lobe lift showed me that rocker ratios are just an approximation. The ratio, and resulting valve movement from zero to 50 deg. of crank rotation was way over 1:75 to 1, as the actual valve movement during it's initial jerk curve showed a ratio as high as 5 to 1, but quickly came into the 1.9 range by 60 degrees, and then settled into a nice 1.79-1.76 ratio by 100 deg. of rotation, and was pretty constant at 1:75 to full lobe lift at 180 deg. opposite of zero lobe.

Bottom line, for a .400" lobe, I got .700" at the valve on both rockers, which is the important part.

Watching what was happening at the valve during that 1st 50 degrees of crank rotation, when the roller wheel was just taking up the lobe ramp was pretty startling though. Never tracked how quickly the valve actually comes off the seat before today, now I have a new respect for the term "aggressive”.

Features are:

1. Bolt down in factory location - no machine work of head - or any mods required. Will fit all OEM heads and the new (IDT) head

2. Pressure/bushing oiled rockershafts just like the factory rockers - no needle bearings - very reliable

3. Uses modern ball/ball pushrods (now use can use 7/16 dia) - adjuster gets oil from lifters thru pushrods. Body/shaft oils thru rocker stands.

4. Goes under factory or repro valve cover - no modifications

5. Uses factory geometry - factory stand height - 1.75 ratio – both

6. Steel "I" beam construction, roller tip (both)

7. Alum. rockerstand, with 3rd hole to pin stand to head for extra stability. Steel stand optional. Only 6 moving parts.

8. Clears 1.625" dia. springs - no problem - no grinding of the body

More info to follow as the project goes forward, and for updates in the near future, click:

http://www.shotgunhemiparts.com/

Anyone can contact me, Eric, at esimone@comcast.net

Hemi Head Flow Numbers

Stock Hemi Heads

Courtesy of Charlie Evans

2.282 x 1.90

These are unported factory original heads, with the original valves and a 30 degree seat angle on the intakes and a 45 degree seat angle on the exhausts, after a valve job.

.100=87/56
.200=154/110
.300=201/158
.400=252/190
.500=297/212
.600=330/226
.700=348/237
.800=351/246

Courtesy of 747JETMECH

2.36 x 1.960

Ported

.100=122/73
.200=220/159
.300=285/196
.400=360/230
.500=405/257
.600=436/270
.700=433/282
.800=419/291

Thor Head Flow Numbers

Courtesy of Charlie Evans

Gen. 2 Head

Lift Intake/Exhaust: Average of 4 ports, exhaust w/o a test pipe.

.200=161/125
.300=240/176
.400=321/233
.500=399/300
.600=460/335
.700=495/352
.800=519/361
.900=530/368
1.000=540/372

could you give me a good hp and torque number for a 3750 lb truck with a 3.20 gear and a c-6 automatic with a stock torque converter just let me know which engine to build form your chart that you made for 460 engines thanks WR