So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

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So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  bosshoss on March 24th 2013, 1:19 am

Just wondering. My first two attempts at modifying a 1/2" box end resulted in broken tools.

dkp
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Lem Evans on March 24th 2013, 10:08 am

Recommended cylinder head stud torque is shown below. A cold re-torque after the first running at
temperature is mandatory to maintain head gasket integrity and combustion seal.
Torque the cylinder head studs in three steps, in sequence:
Step 1. 75 ft./lbs.9/16"; 50 ft./lbs. 7/16"
Step 2. 105 ft./lbs. 9/16"; 65 ft./lbs. 7/16"
Step 3. 135 ft./lbs. on #1 through #6
125 ft./lbs. on #7 through #10

Can you gey one of those "crows foot" deals on it?

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  c.evans on March 24th 2013, 11:21 am

Dean,

To answer your question about the 7/16" studs, it's 65 lbs like what Lem said. Many times I don't torque them with a wrench, but just pull them up by hand/arm until it "feels" like I've got about 65 lbs. Also, we don't R&R the intake manifold to retorque the inner 8 either. Retorque the other head bolts yes, but not those 8 in the valley.

Charlie

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 24th 2013, 11:27 am

First of all ... the original "C" heads don't have 18 head fasteners. The same head with that 18 head bolt pattern was offered as a "D" head.
The "D" & "E" head has even a different 18 head bolt pattern with ALL 7/16" bolts/studs.


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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  bosshoss on March 24th 2013, 12:57 pm

Lem:

Thanks for that dood. I assume #7-10 would be the outside 4 corners yes?

A crows foot box end would work if it was about 4 inches long I think.

Charlie:

That is what I ended up doing. doubled up my 1/2" combo wrench and gave it the old millwright tug. Smile

Randy:

Umm My C460 heads have 18 head bolts. I thought they all did?
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Curt on March 24th 2013, 1:09 pm

bosshoss wrote:

Randy:

Umm My C460 heads have 18 head bolts. I thought they all did?

Laughing Don't argue with him. cheers



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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Wheelie58 on March 24th 2013, 1:29 pm

Regardless of the Alphabet of the head or Thor...
This is what I use...for the 18 bolt deals. These are Snap on.
Keith

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 24th 2013, 1:43 pm

bosshoss wrote:Lem:

Randy:

Umm My C460 heads have 18 head bolts. I thought they all did?

Actually ... none of them did until after 1998 or so. That same casting machined for 18 head bolts was part numbered M-6049-D460.

I should have made it clearer that I was referring to the heads as they were originally offered. I hope the fix here makes it clearer.


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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  DFI429 on March 24th 2013, 1:56 pm

Wheelie58 wrote:Regardless of the Alphabet of the head or Thor...
This is what I use...for the 18 bolt deals. These are Snap on.
Keith

<Torque Adaptors>

Use these all the time on the turbofans.. just remember the 2" that the adaptor adds makes for a .8571 factor.. .8571 x 125FT-LBS = 107FT-LBS with adaptor
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Bret Powell on March 24th 2013, 5:33 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:Lem:

Randy:

Umm My C460 heads have 18 head bolts. I thought they all did?

Actually ... none of them do. That same casting machined for 18 head bolts was part numbered M-6049-D460.

Randy,
What in the world are you talking about?

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  bosshoss on March 24th 2013, 7:22 pm

Wheelie58 wrote:Regardless of the Alphabet of the head or Thor...
This is what I use...for the 18 bolt deals. These are Snap on.
Keith


Ok thats what I'm talkin about.

Thanks Keith.

I was on the Snap On site but couldnt find those puppies.
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  bosshoss on March 24th 2013, 7:23 pm

Wheelie58 wrote:Regardless of the Alphabet of the head or Thor...
This is what I use...for the 18 bolt deals. These are Snap on.
Keith


Ok thats what I'm talkin about.

Thanks Keith.

I was on the Snap On site but couldnt find those puppies.
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 24th 2013, 10:28 pm

Bret Powell wrote:
rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:Lem:

Randy:

Umm My C460 heads have 18 head bolts. I thought they all did?

Actually ... none of them do. That same casting machined for 18 head bolts was part numbered M-6049-D460.

Randy,
What in the world are you talking about?

Bret

Just trying to inform people of the correct original nomenclature ... they can call 'em anything they want but, referring to anything by the correct part number is sometimes important.
That's all. Idea

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  richter69 on March 24th 2013, 10:30 pm

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  bosshoss on March 24th 2013, 10:43 pm

So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 25th 2013, 10:07 am

bosshoss wrote:So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

dkp

Call 'em whatever you want ... that was not the ORIGINAL part number of an 18 head bolt head.
The "C" heads didn't have 18 head bolt holes till after 1998 or so.



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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  DanH on March 25th 2013, 11:08 am

rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

dkp

Call 'em whatever you want ... that was not the ORIGINAL part number of an 18 head bolt head.

my C460 heads and the D460 are only 4 bolt plus 14 studs.
then it could be a 18 stud head if swap the 4 bolts to studs

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  c.evans on March 25th 2013, 2:07 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

dkp

Call 'em whatever you want ... that was not the ORIGINAL part number of an 18 head bolt head.


Randy, I'm like Bret. What point are you trying to make? I've done 57 sets of C-460 heads in my time, including BossHoss's (who started this thread) heads. All of those C-460 heads were 18 bolt heads. They utilize the OEM 10 bolt x 9/16" pattern, plus four more 7/16" across the bottom and four more 7/16" across the top in the valley, for a total of 18 bolts.

As for "ORIGINAL" are you saying it was the bastard pro stock B-460 head? If so, I've seem some of them be 10 bolt heads and some of the later ones be 18 bolt heads.

My understanding of the D-460 head is that they have the same ports as a C-460, but a revised head bolt pattern for the A-500 Pro Stock block,,,,and it is an 18 bolt pattern.

Charlie

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Curt on March 25th 2013, 2:09 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

dkp

Call 'em whatever you want ... that was not the ORIGINAL part number of an 18 head bolt head.

rmcomprandy wrote:First of all ... "C" heads don't have 18 head fasteners. The same head with that 18 head bolt pattern was offered as a "D" head.
The "E" head has even a different 18 head bolt pattern with ALL 7/16" bolts/studs.

So what do you call "C" heads?

The very first set I ever saw in the mid 90's had 18 head bolts. The A460 block had to be modified for the extra 8 fasteners. They were also M-6049-C460s.



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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  c.evans on March 25th 2013, 2:31 pm

Well there are 4 pages of instructions that come with new C-460 heads in the box. IS-6049-C460 dated Jan. 1997. The title says; Instructions For M-6049-C460/D460 Pro Stock Cylinder Heads.

Line item #8 says; "Cylinder head stud kits are available from ford Motorsports for the C-460 cylinder heads, M-6014-G500." Now then as we all know, this stud kit is only for the ten 9/16" studs only,,,,and does not include the extra studs/bolts for the 7/16" holes. That's why I buy those 7/16" studs in bulk. Furthermore, Lem has told me that Ford has discontinued this M-6014-G500 part number.

Randy mentioned the E-460 heads, and I have had my hands on a couple of them. My understanding of them is that they are more or less like the D-460 head, but come with the peanut size port, and the aformentioned revised Pro Stock bolt pattern for the A-500 short deck block.

Hope this helps,

Charlie

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 25th 2013, 6:29 pm

c.evans wrote:
rmcomprandy wrote:
bosshoss wrote:So just to be clear the part number of my cylinder heads is M-6049-C460 and they have 18 bolts per head.

dkp

Call 'em whatever you want ... that was not the ORIGINAL part number of an 18 head bolt head.


Randy, I'm like Bret. What point are you trying to make? I've done 57 sets of C-460 heads in my time, including BossHoss's (who started this thread) heads. All of those C-460 heads were 18 bolt heads. They utilize the OEM 10 bolt x 9/16" pattern, plus four more 7/16" across the bottom and four more 7/16" across the top in the valley, for a total of 18 bolts.

As for "ORIGINAL" are you saying it was the bastard pro stock B-460 head? If so, I've seem some of them be 10 bolt heads and some of the later ones be 18 bolt heads.

My understanding of the D-460 head is that they have the same ports as a C-460, but a revised head bolt pattern for the A-500 Pro Stock block,,,,and it is an 18 bolt pattern.

Charlie

Charlie, I know you probably have all your old catalogs from Ford Motorsport SVO.

Open up one from about 1994, 1995, 1996 about when they were first offered, to I think page 42 to 45; (all those early catalogs had pretty much the same content on the page numbers).
The C460 & D460 head difference is explained there. The "D" did have the Pro Stock 18 head bolt hole locations like the "E" head.
By 1998 the "D" designation was dropped and the "C" got 8 more bolt holes.

Just trying to convey a little history but, people here don't care or seem to want to know about where or how it all started.

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  schmitty on March 25th 2013, 6:58 pm

History lessons are always good. Some just want to be indignant to it though. Cool
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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  richter69 on March 25th 2013, 7:01 pm

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  rmcomprandy on March 25th 2013, 7:14 pm

schmitty wrote:History lessons are always good. Some just want to be indignant to it though. Cool

Indignation seems to happen when a closed mind, for whatever reason, does not want to hear anything differing from what they know
When these heads first came out, some of these people were probably still in kindergarten and all they know is from the last 5 to 10 years.
I understand not knowing the history but, they seem to take that history when delivered with a bit of facetiousness as a personal slap in the face. I only mean it to inform not, to be confrontational.

I type as if they are standing right in front of me. I should know that typewritten word is just not the same.
That's my fault.

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Re: So what are you C Head guys using to torque the 7/16 studs?

Post  Lem Evans on March 25th 2013, 7:22 pm

The 18 fastner D460 was the "Polly Purebred" of the "18" style heads....all fastners were 7/16".

The "18" C460 heads are the hybrid...the 10 std. 9/16" + 8 addition 7/16".

http://www.460ford.com/forum/showthread.php?t=155400&highlight=d460

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