new morel lifters no oil to top?

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 10th 2013, 6:51 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:I have some of the old Crane lifter in hand I'll post a picture when i get a chance......the design of the Crane body has little in common with the Morel lifters.

The newer Morerl lifters certainly have a different type oil band around the lifter, (the top of the line Morel really doesn't have a BAND like the Crane FRPP), however the small oil hole to the top in the FRPP lifters I have here is about .080" above the band with no flat spot or groove connection between them.

I think Morel makes two different lifter bodies also as the ones in a customer's engine looked almost like the Cranes with a full oil band but, said MOREL across the tie bar.
Maybe they discontinued one body type and went to the other ... I will have to find out for sure at the PRI trade show.
 
The Morel Ultra Pro lifters in question are what I'd call a 'column' design [I'm sure that's not what it's called] that the oil runs through the lifter rather than around the waist/oil band.
 
Looks almost like this:
 


The CompCams Elite lifters are also of the 'column' family but, the feed hole for the oil is not at the o.d. of the lifter. The oil gets to the pushrod seat cup internally, being that the oil is running though the lifter.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  466cj on December 11th 2013, 1:06 am

Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

So why didn't you take it up with your Lunati Rep.??? Man where is Chris Straub when you need him!

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  cool40 on December 11th 2013, 8:40 am

466cj wrote:
Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

So why didn't you take it up with your Lunati Rep.??? Man where is Chris Straub when you need him!
why should he have to? He found some that worked.
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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Carl on December 11th 2013, 10:30 am

466cj wrote:
Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

So why didn't you take it up with your Lunati Rep.??? Man where is Chris Straub when you need him!

Lunati has been made aware of the issue.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 11th 2013, 10:54 am

466cj wrote:
Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

So why didn't you take it up with your Lunati Rep.??? Man where is Chris Straub when you need him!

I contacted Chris months ago.......Morel says the modification is not needed  Rolling Eyes 

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Carl on December 11th 2013, 10:57 am

Lem Evans wrote: Rolling Eyes 

x2

 Mad

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  bbf-falcon on December 11th 2013, 2:43 pm

Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

X2

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  466cj on December 11th 2013, 4:34 pm

If they have been made aware then all one can do. The current Comp Cams Endure-X is a nice lifter...

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 11th 2013, 10:24 pm

466cj wrote:If they have been made aware then all one can do. The current Comp Cams Endure-X is a nice lifter...

The Ultra Pro Morels are 'nicer' and more expensive lifter.....'they' just need to address the issue.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  powerstrokeace on December 11th 2013, 10:35 pm

Carl wrote:
466cj wrote:
Carl wrote:I encountered a top end oiling problem with a D9/Morel combination too, and running the engine didn't improve the situation.  I screwed around with grooving the lifters, and it certainly allowed for top end oiling, but I didn't feel comfortable in making a determination of weather the groove was too little or too much.  Installing Comp lifters resolved the issue with no other changes.

I'm also not going to sell a customer buying parts a set of lifters that requires him to either take apart his engine to modify his lifter bore clearance, or grind on the shiny new "precision made part" to get it to work when there are other options that will drop in and work properly from the get.

So why didn't you take it up with your Lunati Rep.??? Man where is Chris Straub when you need him!

Lunati has been made aware of the issue.

It's funny as i had the same issue 2 years ago freshen up a motor and my lifters were sent back to Lunati to be rebuilt. they lost them and sent me a new set in return. Ran the motor for 10-12 passes and found the push rods eating them selfs up. Found the same problem A460 block and had to make a oil channel. the new Lunati lifter are being built by Morel

Funny thing was we hurt a lifter as well not from oiling. called lunati and they replace the lifters and also found my originals that had been channeled as well and rebuild them for the incovenice. I will never not prime any motor again

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  466cj on December 11th 2013, 11:13 pm

Lem Evans wrote:
466cj wrote:If they have been made aware then all one can do. The current Comp Cams Endure-X is a nice lifter...

The Ultra Pro Morels are 'nicer' and more expensive lifter.....'they' just need to address the issue.  

From what you said 'they' already addressed the issue by saying is nothing wrong on their end. Are a lot of choices in lifters as you well know. Can either go with something else or check/modify clearances as needed.

Really having the correct oil amount to the top end takes some experimentation IMHO. I think many error on the side of more oil to avoid the complaint of burned up pushrod ends which is understandable. Then we use a bigger oil capacity and HV pump to cover the two quarts of oil in the heads, well many be not that much, but you get my point.

Not sure this is so much a problem of Moral lifters than the fact that you have to have proper lifter bore clearance with their lifter which most nobody wants to check or address. In my view is more a problem of the hobby which is for the most part bolting stuff together.

If you want to use a higher end part that holds a certain tolerance and requires a certain bore size and tolerance than need to respect its requirements. I used to think these engines were hi tech, but really are not, and how much stuff can be off is amazing.

As I see it the complaint with Moral is they won't modify their lifter to be "good enough" and settle for the lowest common denominator which is sloppier tolerances and pump more oil to the top end. I will say they need to include a warning in the box of their lifter requirements or give in to the market as it is and provide something that is in sync with the sloppy tolerances of these engines.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 12th 2013, 12:27 am

Dime store novel.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  466cj on December 12th 2013, 2:06 am

Lem Evans wrote:Dime store novel.

And it did not even cost you a dime... Shouldn't you save the insults for YB?  Razz

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 12th 2013, 9:52 am

466cj wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:Dime store novel.

And it did not even cost you a dime... Shouldn't you save the insults for YB?  Razz

Sorry if that insulted you  Smile  I always think of 'novel' when I see a longish post. My friend Paul Kane is one of the best novelist on here.

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Paul Kane on December 12th 2013, 11:16 am

Lem Evans wrote:
Sorry if that insulted you  Smile  I always think of 'novel' when I see a longish post. My friend Paul Kane is one of the best novelist on here.
Sit down, Lem, lemme tell ya a little story...  Razz 
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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  Lem Evans on December 12th 2013, 11:47 am

Paul Kane wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:
Sorry if that insulted you  Smile  I always think of 'novel' when I see a longish post. My friend Paul Kane is one of the best novelist on here.
Sit down, Lem, lemme tell ya a little story...  Razz 

Are you insulted too?  Very Happy 

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Re: new morel lifters no oil to top?

Post  466cj on December 12th 2013, 4:26 pm

Laughing you guys are too much!

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Infomercial

Post  Gary Blair on December 12th 2013, 5:41 pm

 Laughing Me likes the food processor infomercial for improved oiling.
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