oil psi issues

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 16th 2013, 9:39 am

cool40 wrote:
i took the pan off yesterday and looked at it a while.then i put it back on.Idea 

Cool while the pan was off, was there an opportunity for pictures of the pan's internal construction?

Dave.

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  IDT-572 on July 16th 2013, 12:13 pm

I use the Moroso 20625 with 8 qt's of oil. Works good no problem on deceleration.
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  Barney on July 16th 2013, 4:24 pm

IDT-572 wrote:I use the Moroso 20625 with 8 qt's of oil.  Works good no problem on deceleration.

 x2
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  bbf-falcon on July 16th 2013, 5:31 pm

IDT-572 wrote:I use the Moroso 20625 with 8 qt's of oil.  Works good no problem on deceleration.

Thats the pan I was using also Blake. Probably not the latest/greatest,but gets the job done.

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 16th 2013, 9:32 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
cool40 wrote:
i took the pan off yesterday and looked at it a while.then i put it back on.Idea 

Cool while the pan was off, was there an opportunity for pictures of the pan's internal construction?

Dave.
matter of fact. Very Happy 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  David Cole on July 16th 2013, 9:38 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
cool40 wrote:
i took the pan off yesterday and looked at it a while.then i put it back on.Idea 

Cool while the pan was off, was there an opportunity for pictures of the pan's internal construction?

Dave.

Unless they have changed something, I have the same pan.

Solid windage tray



Trap door in sump:


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Re: oil psi issues

Post  David Cole on July 16th 2013, 9:40 pm

cool40 wrote:

matter of fact. Very Happy 

Treed me lol
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 16th 2013, 9:46 pm

David Cole wrote:
cool40 wrote:

matter of fact. Very Happy 

Treed me lol
you have better pic's! thanks Smile i have 10qt's in it now to try next time.
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 17th 2013, 1:10 am

Those are nice looking pans. They seem to be of different designs. Cool's pan appears to have a single slosh door at the sump hinged at the bottom and the angled material it's attached to seems to have the bend facing forward. When I look at the original picture on page 1, the angled material (sump's front) appears to be welded with the angle facing to the rear.

On Dave's photo, the sump's front wall or angled material, the angle is facing to the rear and the two slosh doors are hinged at the top.

They are both nice pans, pans far beyond anything I have ever owned although, it seems the angled material in Dave's pan, facing the rear would do a better job of controlling the oil during deceleration. I'm not sure whether either door works better, hinged at the top or bottom and one door instead of two. Also on Dave's pan the windage trays edge is close to the sump's forward wall, somewhat aiding the containment of oil in the sump or at least delivering the tray's oil to the sump.

Guys don't get me wrong, I'm just another jealous son-of-a-bitch, but I can't understand why those pans as nice as they are need 10 quarts of oil to keep the sump covered. It was wrote an extra 1 1/2 to 2 quarts of oil made a difference in oil pressure, does that mean 8 to 8 1/2 quarts of oil is up in the engine! The front sump (oil pump) may contain a quart or two but that just seems to be a lot of total oil!

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 17th 2013, 10:15 pm

here is another pic,the only other one i have.it looks like the door is back a little more than Davids. its hinged at the top too.Smile 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 18th 2013, 10:40 am

Cool looks great! At a convenient time, would it be possible to post a picture of the pan with the windage trays removed? If I seem to be degrading your oil pan's construction, I apologize. My educational curiosity is need of educating!

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 18th 2013, 12:55 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:Cool looks great! At a convenient time, would it be possible to post a picture of the pan with the windage trays removed? If I seem to be degrading your oil pan's construction, I apologize. My educational curiosity is need of educating!

Dave.
i dont take anything as degrading Dave,same as i dont want Lem,who i got it from or the guy who built it to think i'm degrading them or the pan.i could have taken pics cuz i had it all out to clean bearing junk out but i did'nt. I'm looking to learn as well,thats why i posted this.Very Happy 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 19th 2013, 11:58 am

In the pictures Dave posted, it appears the oil pan's driver side windage tray is rolled with a different radius front to rear. It appears the finished radius offers a drain toward the oil pump pickup's sump. I can't decide if the passenger side has the same drain formed into it. If there is no rotating assembly clearance issues, could a lip or wall of some design be attached to the forward edges of each windage trays? The addition may not control the majority of the oil's direction which to drain, although persist an adequate amount of oil flow toward the
oil pump pickup's sump instead of forward into the oil pump's sump, not only during acceleration, maybe during deceleration.

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 27th 2013, 1:49 am

update! 10.5 qt in the pan tonight and all is well. it would drop to 40psi then recover.Very Happy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_4EwS9BWoY&feature=youtu.be
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 27th 2013, 11:09 am

cool40 wrote:update! 10.5 qt in the pan tonight and all is well. it would drop to 40psi then recover.Very Happy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_4EwS9BWoY&feature=youtu.be

Cool, I'm glad your concerns have been addressed. Car looks and sounds great!

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 27th 2013, 12:25 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
cool40 wrote:update! 10.5 qt in the pan tonight and all is well. it would drop to 40psi then recover.Very Happy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_4EwS9BWoY&feature=youtu.be

Cool, I'm glad your concerns have been addressed. Car looks and sounds great!

Dave.
thanks! The air was real thick so it could use less fuel.i could tell by the water temp its bad fat for this time of year,but safe! I'm happy for now Very Happy 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  IDT-572 on July 27th 2013, 1:28 pm

look like it spun bad
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 27th 2013, 3:35 pm

IDT-572 wrote:look like it spun bad
wheel speed..... Wink 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  Lem Evans on July 28th 2013, 1:12 am

Paul Kane wrote:It sounds as though the oil is flowing away from the pickup screen at deceleration. You need to take a good look at that pan and figure out what pan mods are necessary to keep the oil around the pickup and the pickup screen submerged in oil.

Paul

Lee, you better start grinding and welding on that pan A.S.A.P.

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  LivermoreDave on July 28th 2013, 7:20 am

Lem Evans wrote:Lee, you better start grinding and welding on that pan A.S.A.P.

A.S.A.P. = Adjust Sump And Pan

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  richter69 on July 28th 2013, 10:27 am

Lem Evans wrote:
Paul Kane wrote:It sounds as though the oil is flowing away from the pickup screen at deceleration. You need to take a good look at that pan and figure out what pan mods are necessary to keep the oil around the pickup and the pickup screen submerged in oil.

Paul

Lee, you better start grinding and welding on that pan A.S.A.P.


in other words dont just keep adding oil to crutch the problem..... if you must do it that way the accumulator is the best option as when the extra oil is not needed its stored in the accumulator not making the pan overfull.

and on the same not why should a new pan need to be cut and welded on? .... thatnis unless its the wrong pan for the application to begin with.
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  rmcomprandy on July 28th 2013, 10:33 am

richter69 wrote:
why should a new pan need to be cut and welded on? .... thatnis unless its the wrong pan for the application to begin with.

When it comes to aftermarket custom engine parts, I always presume that NOTHING just fits. Because, more than 70% of the time, out of the box it won't do the job or it doesn't fit.

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Re: oil psi issues

Post  Lem Evans on July 28th 2013, 11:09 am

richter69 wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:
Paul Kane wrote:It sounds as though the oil is flowing away from the pickup screen at deceleration. You need to take a good look at that pan and figure out what pan mods are necessary to keep the oil around the pickup and the pickup screen submerged in oil.

Paul

Lee, you better start grinding and welding on that pan A.S.A.P.


in other words dont just keep adding oil to crutch the problem..... if you must do it that way the accumulator is the best option as when the extra oil is  not needed its stored in the accumulator not making the pan overfull.

and on the same not why should a new pan need to be cut and welded on? .... thatnis unless its the wrong pan for the application to begin with.

I was kidding about grinding etc. Lee's pan has 75 square inches more floor and is 2" deeper in the front than the mentioned Moroso fox pan. I don't see how the the larger pan can use the same 8 qts. that the smaller Moroso pan does.

An external oil pump would allow a taller front wall for the sump. The reason the Moroso fox does well on decel. is the 4" tall front wall. The trade off is that the pickup tube is using the same territory the windage devices need.


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Re: oil psi issues

Post  cool40 on July 28th 2013, 11:22 am

I have a dry sump system on the way but may just wait till later to put it on.thank for all the good advice,this may help somebody else too.Very Happy 
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Re: oil psi issues

Post  Lem Evans on July 28th 2013, 11:32 am


 
This is the pan that is on QTR Warrior's engine. Another plus of the taller front wall is .....while it does reduce the total area of the pan, the capacity of the sump goes up.

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