Education

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Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 12:34 am

Does anyone else with children or that teach's, have any experience or idea's about this. Try to keep to forum rules please! I am only interested in other's first hand experience on the matter, and how it is working for their children, or if it is being proposed in their area. Any insight of related to the techinical fields (I/E Welding, auto mechanic's ect.) and it's application, would be very constuctive to the topic.

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Re: Education

Post  whitefield on January 9th 2014, 1:14 am

supervel45 wrote:Does anyone else with children or that teach's, have any experience or idea's about this.                          Try to keep to forum rules please!                                                                                                      I am only interested in other's first hand experience on the matter, and how it is working for their children, or if it is being proposed in their area. Any insight of related to the techinical fields (I/E Welding, auto mechanic's ect.) and it's application, would be very constuctive to the topic.


Common core ! It is BS!!!!

Now with that out of the way ! We got introduced to it two years ago here in Tennessee .
It is a lot more reading and writing assignments for those in CTE classes as well as the academic classes and less hands on for the CTE classes . Math and science are a big part of it too !
It is also suppose to be the subjects taught the same across the state . Let's say if one child transfers from one school or county to the other he or she would be able to be taught the same in another school or county and be in the same or close to the same chapter as the other school or county. This is a very half butt explanation , it is more intense an comprehensive than my ignorant mind could ever explain .

I can give you a link to Tennessee Edu web page .
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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 1:34 am

They have been pushing it in Texas at least 5 years or more. We have fought it some too, but most people or not informed, or have an inside tract, to it, and the ramification's involved with C-Core. The only possiable good use I could see come out or it is in the skills and trades type classes. The teachers loose alot of discression on lesson planning and exucution, and it is headed to centralized control on the national level, like heathcare. It also takes power away from PTA boards, so parents can be excluded on a local district level. The cost of lowering text books is the vechicle used to promote it, as was the ACA and insurance business, that was rallied in the same manner, over cost benifits. Now that, that's out of the way, as the previous poster put it, does anyone have it operating in their area, and how is it doing, compared to your old system and what issue's have caused problems?

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Re: Education

Post  whatbumper on January 9th 2014, 10:31 am

I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state. As a matter of fact, the opposite is true. We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 10:58 am

whatbumper wrote:I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state.  As a matter of fact, the opposite is true.  We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.
                                                                                                                                        In the Katy area it has come up as a campaign issue for some canidates in the 2014 elections, and a similar deal was proposed around 2004 or so in a PTA meeting I attended.


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Re: Education

Post  Dave C. on January 9th 2014, 11:11 am

This is a good thread. I don't have children in school but that doesn't mean it's not important.. Based on some of the comments and sentence structure I've read lately it appears that some of us (including me) should have paid more attention in school.... If the children don't try to learn in school and if the parent/parents aren't involved in their education at home I don't think it matters what they are taught ... Please continue.  study 

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Re: Education

Post  4thHorseman on January 9th 2014, 11:42 am

I'm skeptical of anything passed down as edict by the feds like this. In theory it could be good to put all schools on the same page, but in practice will it dumb down our education standards worse than they are now? Will it serve to "indoctrinate" our children to the leftist ideology as so many of our current teaching staff and college professors attempt? This too often tends to be the results (and intensions) of federal plans for us.
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Re: Education

Post  LivermoreDave on January 9th 2014, 11:55 am

whatbumper wrote:I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state.  As a matter of fact, the opposite is true.  We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.

A question if I may? In your reply, the word "We". Does "We" describe you as an educator or as a parent?

Dave.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 11:57 am

Thanks, Dave C. If you think our writing and sentence structure is bad you should see some of the kids. The use of cell prones and texting, and the lack or reading and writing book reports is not helping them, for sure. They seem to be turning into bumbleing robots stuck on an I phone, or game boy anymore. The schools seem more interested in studying for standardized tests than spending time going over homework and grading material, to improve the student's weak area's. My Dad was a teacher in the early 70's along with two of my uncle's, and they all got out because of the way thing's where degenerating back them. Do all schools require a second langauge to graduate, or is this a Texas thing? Seems if you can't read and write english, proficiently, you should focus on it more. Their deductive reasoning skills, and critical thinking seems very low to me, but maybe we were all stupid as teenagers, and just to old to remember now. Trying to make teaching a 8 hour day for 9 months a year, with out an hour or two bring home work, for the students, as well as the teachers, is not helping the problem. I may be off base here, as some people may due this, but it does not seem like it around here. If we threw out all the TV's, Internet and I-phones, and went back to books and pen and paper, we might be better off? I am not saying the electronic's/computor's are bad, they are not being used constructively, and are causing to much distraction of the students focus.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 12:28 pm

How do the book companies fit into the puzzle? Will C-Core Help, Hurt, or not effect their profit?

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Re: Education

Post  whitefield on January 9th 2014, 12:38 pm

supervel45 wrote:Thanks, Dave C. If you think our writing and sentence structure is bad you should see some of the kids. The use of cell prones and texting, and the lack or reading and writing book reports is not helping them, for sure. They seem to be turning into bumbleing robots stuck on an I phone, or game boy anymore. The schools seem more interested in studying for standardized tests than spending time going over homework and grading material, to improve the student's weak area's. My Dad was a teacher in the early 70's along with two of my uncle's, and they all got out because of the way thing's where degenerating back them. Do all schools require a second langauge to graduate, or is this a Texas thing? Seems if you can't read and write english, proficiently, you should focus on it more. Their deductive reasoning skills, and critical thinking seems very low to me, but maybe we were all stupid as teenagers, and just to old to remember now. Trying to make teaching a 8 hour day for 9 months a year, with out an hour or two bring home work, for the students, as well as the teachers, is not helping the problem. I may be off base here, as some people may due this, but it does not seem like it around here. If we threw out all the TV's, Internet and I-phones, and went back to books and pen and paper, we might be better off? I am not saying the electronic's/computor's are bad, they are not being used constructively, and are causing to much distraction of the students focus.

The real problem is passing a student along from grade to grade that do not have the basic reading writing and math skills. To do any CTE class you have to have all of those and in CTE they been doing them for years.
Look at how much smarter the older generations are . We do to much talking and not enough doing !

I have a news paper cartoon with the students pictured in there desk with books. One student turns to the other and says hey how do you turn this thing on !
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Re: Education

Post  the Coug on January 9th 2014, 12:46 pm

the problem I have with Education now days is none of the little SOBs can do math in their heads.... if they don't have a cell phone or calculator they are dumb as a box of rocks. When I went to school if you ever got caught with a calculator you flunked the course for the year... there are a lot of kids now days that graduated and just barely can spell.....Hell we have people on here that can't spell for Chit, you have  to cyfer whut them says  Rolling Eyes
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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 1:04 pm

the Coug wrote:the problem I have with Education now days is none of the little SOBs can do math in their heads.... if they don't have a cell phone or calculator they are dumb as a box of rocks. When I went to school if you ever got caught with a calculator you flunked the course for the year... there are a lot of kids now days that graduated and just barely can spell.....Hell we have people on here that can't spell for Chit, you have  to cyfer whut them says  Rolling Eyes
We need to go back to flash cards for basic math, and have the parents start with their children at around 4 years old. Same with reading. Be careful though I hear DR. Zeuss was quite a Subversive, by his own admission. The more you read the easier it is to pick up proper spelling and grammer, if it is not one of our blogs,LoL. Spell check is another crutch that makes people lazy. When we get computerized toilet paper, we better not run out of batteries, or the shit will be deep. Suspect 

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Re: Education

Post  kim on January 9th 2014, 1:17 pm

I'm not part of the spelling police, as a matter of fact, probably one of the worst offenders. Not because I can’t spell, but because when typing a message I'm doing it while doing 3 or 4 other things, I want to get the information out, and I don't take the time to proof read what I typed before I send the message.

I would fight against a national standardized education platform as adamantly as I would fight against national gun registration, national health insurance, damn near anything "nation" wide.

First and foremost it’s not in the Federal or National governments charter to determine the level of education that is required for our children. The federal governments charter is protection of international boarders (failing miserably at this) protection and establishment of international trade, (failing miserably at this, we are a consumer nation, we trade little to nothing outward) and then lastly ensure the free flow of internal commerce, (Ohio can’t block commerce between Michigan and Kentucky). Other than that, everything else the national government is doing, has been designated as states’ rights (obligations) and the state legislatures have become lazy and meaningless, as the state governments no longer take care of the people within the state.

An independent education system allows some schools to do a poor job at educating the people that attend. There is a definite truth to this problem, but it also allows many schools to excel. It is the local governing bodies, Parents, School boards, City government, and then lastly the State that should intervene if there is the desire to change the way a school operates. For the most part, parents decide on the level of their child’s education, with a decision of where they live, and if a child is schooled in a premier public education facility, a slack one, or private education, or home schooled. Parenting isn't the act of squirting the kid out; it’s the lifelong responsibility to do the things that make that child a great adult.

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Re: Education

Post  whitefield on January 9th 2014, 1:34 pm

More school ,more testing, forcing a student to do work or subject that they don' t understand . Teaching to stander test that all students are required to make a certain grade or percentage . Does not Make a student smarter . At the school where I work we spend money to give a troubled or failing student extra opportunity to make up work ,day missed,ect. Then we bus fifty to seventy five students home at five o'clock every afternoon. Extra cost to the county so the school can meet there graduation rate . These students will never make the grade because it means nothing to them or there parents .
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Re: Education

Post  4thHorseman on January 9th 2014, 3:35 pm

I have 3 kids. One graduated and married in the Army. One about to graduate. One just entering high school. From what I have witnessed first hand, the skills instilled by graduation time -and required for graduation- are no where near what they were 25 years ago when I graduated. Basic math, reading, writing, and history knowledge just is not there. It's all been dumbed down. I've helped my two youngest with math questions. The kid was clueless as to how to solve it. I work through the problem, showing line by line as I solve it to the correct result. They go into school and repeat the process to arrive at the correct result only to have it marked wrong by the teacher because the kid didn't use "new math".... some new taught way of arriving at the result. WTF? We put a man on the friggin' moon, fly jets at mach 3, and build skyscrapers and suspension bridges solving equations with "old math" but that's no longer the way to do it. I call bullshit. There's a profound lack of knowledge in our founding principles, important events that have shaped our world.... just a huge void of knowing how we got to where we are at now. Employers don't pay for "stupid". Good luck obtaining some useful skills worth paying them for.
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Re: Education

Post  kim on January 9th 2014, 4:05 pm

The reason the young fall for the feel good election promises. Socialism sounds "fair". The crap they learned and the way the learned it and the way they slid through school.... was fair.

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Re: Education

Post  bbf-falcon on January 9th 2014, 9:58 pm

Guy's I agree w/a lot of your answers .The link I'am posting does not have anything to do w/original topic but is a good Educational tool from Very young to old farts like me. I let my little 4 1/2 yr old play it on my phone and it's amazing how fast she picked it up. All I ask is just try this YOURSELF,it's actually fun when you have a few to kill.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.akbur.mathsworkout&hl=en

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Re: Education

Post  whatbumper on January 9th 2014, 10:25 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
whatbumper wrote:I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state.  As a matter of fact, the opposite is true.  We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.

A question if I may? In your reply, the word "We". Does "We" describe you as an educator or as a parent?

Dave.

That was a parent and educator response. I am fortunate to be located within an hour of Raytheon, Texas Instruments, Interstate Battery, and many more multi-million to multi-billion dollar companies and we go out and visit them to see what they actually want in an employee. With the standards that Texas has in place we have room to adjust our students curriculum to match what is wanted by many companies while still maintaining a balance between college prep, military and work-force training.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 10:29 pm

^^^^^^^^ Funny how the tittle appeared, I did not plan it that way. Lots of good information and ideas so for.


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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 10:41 pm

whatbumper wrote:
LivermoreDave wrote:
whatbumper wrote:I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state.  As a matter of fact, the opposite is true.  We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.

A question if I may? In your reply, the word "We". Does "We" describe you as an educator or as a parent?

Dave.

That was a parent and educator response.  I am fortunate to be located within an hour of Raytheon, Texas Instruments, Interstate Battery, and many more multi-million to multi-billion dollar companies and we go out and visit them to see what they actually want in an employee.  With the standards that Texas has in place we have room to adjust our students curriculum to match what is wanted by many companies while still maintaining a balance between college prep, military and work-force training.
You are very fortunate in the DFW area if that is your situation. HISD has or used to have magnet schools, for this. It's a good idea in theory, for the craft's and skill's, not sure how good it works in practice though. I am all for this, and the students picking a profession early on, especially if they don't plan on a 4-8year colledge professional career.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 10:54 pm

bbf-falcon wrote:Guy's I agree w/a lot of your answers .The link I'am posting does not have anything to do w/original topic but is a good Educational tool from Very young to old farts like me. I let my little 4 1/2 yr old play it on my phone and it's amazing how fast she picked it up. All I ask is just try this YOURSELF,it's actually fun when you have a few to kill.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.akbur.mathsworkout&hl=en
                                                                                                                                         From birth to 6-7 years are critical in a childs mental developement and learning skills. Consistancey is critical from the parent to instill, organiztion and discipline, to form a good student to enter school. The child usually does'nt get this at daycare as the people just want to get paid, and don't have a vested personal interest in the child like the parent does. It also confuses the child with to many authority figures, at too early of an age. This is one of the things that has changed in recent history, and not for the better.


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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 11:16 pm

4thHorseman wrote:I have 3 kids.  One graduated and married in the Army.  One about to graduate.  One just entering high school.  From what I have witnessed first hand, the skills instilled by graduation time -and required for graduation- are no where near what they were 25 years ago when I graduated.  Basic math, reading, writing, and history knowledge just is not there.  It's all been dumbed down.  I've helped my two youngest with math questions.  The kid was clueless as to how to solve it.  I work through the problem, showing line by line as I solve it to the correct result.  They go into school and repeat the process to arrive at the correct result only to have it marked wrong by the teacher because the kid didn't use "new math".... some new taught way of arriving at the result.  WTF?  We put a man on the friggin' moon, fly jets at mach 3, and build skyscrapers and suspension bridges solving equations with "old math" but that's no longer the way to do it.  I call bullshit.  There's a profound lack of knowledge in our founding principles, important events that have shaped our world.... just a huge void of knowing how we got to where we are at now.  Employers don't pay for "stupid".  Good luck obtaining some useful skills worth paying them for.
                                                                                                                                        Excellent.    Keep this in mind. Did we pay that much attention to anything prior to 1900 in school or was that ancient history in our minds?  The industrial revolution started or took off after 1900.  The electric internet age really took off after the year 2000. Your perspective on history starts from the day you are born, and your actual memory of events. You can design the bridge on a computer, but it will not build one for you yet! Even with cheap labor, you will need intelligent people to run the job's and this is what seems to be in decline now. I guess when all the infustrure crumble's the system will correct itself with higher pay incentive to get more people into these fields? If not they will have to be imported from abroad. That is fine in peacetime, but could cause serious problem's if a war (Cold or Hot) developes.

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 11:33 pm

kim wrote:The reason the young fall for the feel good election promises.  Socialism sounds "fair".  The crap they learned and the way the learned it and the way they slid through school.... was fair.
                                                                                                                                        Yes But.   Why?      Have parent's lost all infuence?          Due parent's support this also? Does Policital Corectness/Tollerance come into play?

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Re: Education

Post  supervel45 on January 9th 2014, 11:43 pm

[quote="whatbumper"]I'm a high school principal in Texas for my day job and have never heard that it is being pushed for in the state.  As a matter of fact, the opposite is true.  We want to control what our kids learn and the courses they take and not let it be as standardized as c-core.[/quot                                                                                                                                          " As a matter of fact, the opposite is true"                                                                                          This does not make sense, what were you pushing against then? Sounds like a contadiction to me, or a company line? I will try and add some links to were common core is coming from, and who is pushing it tommorow. From most of what I have read it is being pushed from the federal level, but in a hush hush fashion. I was a little suprised to see Jeb Bush behind it in one article.


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