if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

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if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  racinghabbit on January 20th 2014, 1:28 pm

if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj.. I have a c8, d1, d3 , and one off a 87 f250
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  460pulling on January 20th 2014, 2:58 pm

I would think the police interceptor intake would be next inline after the scj if not the same as the scj.
68-71 would be about the same as a d3ve.

What heads are you running? Intended rpm range? I believe most stock intakes are around 1500-5500rpms. That's excluding the scj and police intake.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  racinghabbit on January 20th 2014, 3:10 pm

running 1500-5500
stock e7 truck heads ... with bigger cam and springs...
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 20th 2014, 3:29 pm

460pulling wrote:I would think the police interceptor intake would be next inline after the scj if not the same as the scj.
68-71 would be about the same as a d3ve.

What heads are you running? Intended rpm range? I believe most stock intakes are around 1500-5500rpms. That's excluding the scj and police intake.
Keep in mind the Carb. flanges are different on the PI and CJ intakes from the SCJ. If you want the Holley flange, I believe the SCJ is the only Ford performance option, for the taller intakes, without carb. adaptors.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  LivermoreDave on January 21st 2014, 8:40 am

supervel45 wrote:Keep in mind the Carb flanges are different on the PI and CJ intakes from the SCJ. If you want the Holley flange, I believe the SCJ is the only Ford performance option, for the taller intakes, without carb. adaptors.

Although I don't know the performance value of earlier Ford 385 Series intake manifolds, it seems if memory serves me correctly a Holley 4160 was a Ford service replacement for some early non SCJ Ford 385's.

Dave.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  rmcomprandy on January 21st 2014, 10:23 am

LivermoreDave wrote:
supervel45 wrote:Keep in mind the Carb flanges are different on the PI and CJ intakes from the SCJ. If you want the Holley flange, I believe the SCJ is the only Ford performance option, for the taller intakes, without carb. adaptors.

Although I don't know the performance value of earlier Ford 385 Series intake manifolds, it seems if memory serves me correctly a Holley 4160 was a Ford service replacement for some early non SCJ Ford 385's.

Dave.

YES ... it was the replacement for the Ford/Autolite carb which had near the same size bores; there was an EGR plate between the carb and manifold. There was also an intake manifold for the Ford/Autolite carburetor with 2" secondary bores, (series 4350 I believe), which was a pretty good intake.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 21st 2014, 1:00 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
supervel45 wrote:Keep in mind the Carb flanges are different on the PI and CJ intakes from the SCJ. If you want the Holley flange, I believe the SCJ is the only Ford performance option, for the taller intakes, without carb. adaptors.

Although I don't know the performance value of earlier Ford 385 Series intake manifolds, it seems if memory serves me correctly a Holley 4160 was a Ford service replacement for some early non SCJ Ford 385's.

Dave.
1. SCJ=Holley 2. CJ=QuadraJet 3. PI=Odd Ball Autolite? Some of the 70's trucks came with Holley's and AutoLite's. EGR came in 1972 I believe. A CJ intake with a big QJ tuned my be an option if he is in a factory restricted class. Edelbrock used to make a 895 CFM or so, and they ran really well from personal experience, if he can find one. SCJ's go for about $150 if he want's to run Holley. As for the stock port low risers, I don't think there is much difference, except carb. pad, and EGR.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  460pulling on January 21st 2014, 1:03 pm

Aren't E7 heads fuelie heads? Will any other intake fit other than a fuelie intake? Or am I confusing date codes.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 21st 2014, 1:18 pm

racinghabbit wrote:if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj.. I have a c8, d1, d3 , and one off a 87 f250
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Out of all the ones you have the C8 or D1 would be my pick. If you are going to use the Comp Cam that you had for sale, in this engine, it would benifit from a better intake than any of these. I  would hunt down one of the factory HP pieces, or go aftermarket alum.. Keep in mind the transmission kick down lever on a C-6 also when picking carburetors, if it is an automatic. The Ford trucks as for as I know, at least the later ones went to Holley 4180-c carbs. Same base as the 4150/4160, and had EGR.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  racinghabbit on January 21st 2014, 6:22 pm

the casting look like e8 .....
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 21st 2014, 9:15 pm

racinghabbit wrote:the casting look like e8 .....
 Go to Proven Builds in this forum. I bumped an old thread tittled Low Buck Truck Motor, that has some good info on E8 heads and other info you might like as well. Hope  this helps?http://www.429-460.com/t2621-low-buck-truck-motor

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  BOSS 429 on January 21st 2014, 9:38 pm

racinghabbit wrote:if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj.. I have a c8, d1, d3 , and one off a 87 f250



Not clear as in stock iron, or alum? the Shelby (buddy bar)<( stock as in ford part num) intake is a great intake in alum. otherwise like was said the scj, cj, or police is about it.Now the police has a 4150 bolt pattern and with quick work with a die grinder to clear throttle blades works well. ported its works very well as does all of the above. we have made over 600hp with this manifold
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  strokedmyford on January 21st 2014, 10:12 pm

The old iron cj intakes are easy to find if you want to run one, they came on all the industrial engines clear into the 90's. I have 2 in the shop right now.
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Bret Powell on January 21st 2014, 10:38 pm

All of the OMC marine 460 intakes are SCJ intakes also. PI has spread bore w/holley bolt pattern.

With some work, a good 460ish sized shortblock with roller cam and good compression, a good set of heads, 600 horse with one of these intakes is a breeze.

Bret

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 21st 2014, 10:43 pm

racinghabbit wrote:the casting look like e8 .....
What about this, are they fuelie heads, and how will the big intake ports work?

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Super Snake Steve on January 21st 2014, 11:36 pm

Sense we are on the subject of intake manifolds maybe someone can answer my question.without starting a new thread.  I have a stock scj .030 over in a 79 4x4 will be driven on the street 90 percent having a custom cam ground not sure of exact spec but around .570 lift in/exh duration @.050 236 my question is would a ford svo dual plane alum. Intake port matched to Cj gaskets be better than my iron scj intake. If this is the wrong place to ask ill start a new thread thanks

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Super Snake Steve on January 21st 2014, 11:38 pm


Sense we are on the subject of intake manifolds maybe someone can answer my question.without starting a new thread.  I have a stock scj .030 over in a 79 4x4 will be driven on the street 90 percent having a custom cam ground not sure of exact spec but around .570 lift in/exh duration @.050 236 my question is would a ford svo dual plane alum. Intake port matched to Cj gaskets be better than my iron scj intake. If this is the wrong place to ask ill start a new thread thanks



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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  rmcomprandy on January 22nd 2014, 12:21 am

A 460 engine in 73 or 74, (I can't remember exactly which one), with D3VE heads came with a ThermoQuad carb so, that manifold pattern will fit a Quadrajet as well.

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Paul Kane on January 22nd 2014, 11:24 am

rmcomprandy wrote:A 460 engine in 73 or 74, (I can't remember exactly which one), with D3VE heads came with a ThermoQuad carb so, that manifold pattern will fit a Quadrajet as well.
My 1974 Mercury Colony Park wagon had the 460 with the Thermoquad. 15.5 mpg on the tiny primaries (highway), and would bury the speedo on those massive secondaries and keep accelerating. I still miss that wagon.
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Paul Kane on January 22nd 2014, 11:35 am

460pulling wrote:Aren't E7 heads fuelie heads? Will any other intake fit other than a fuelie intake? Or am I confusing date codes.
E7TE 460 heads are fuelie heads, but they went onto 1988-1992 460FI engines.  The 1987 460 was a carb engine that used E6TE heads.  There are also E8TE heads, which are like the D3VE/E6TE head configuration. The E8TE heads are often referred to as "motorhome heads" since they were produced post 460FI and most ended up on large chassis vehicles that were allowed to meet more lenient emissions standards.
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  Paul Kane on January 22nd 2014, 12:06 pm

racinghabbit wrote:if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj.. I have a c8, d1, d3 , and one off a 87 f250...running 1500-5500...stock e7 truck heads ... with bigger cam and springs...
The standard iron passenger car intakes (such as the C8, etc) and performance factory intakes (such as SCJ & PI, etc) are completely different animals. None of them are perfect choices for 1500-5500 rpm in a stock stroke, moderate compression 460 such as the parts combinaton you describe.   With the factory standard intakes, breathability falls off long before 5500 rpm, and with the performance intakes' low speed torque/power falls off at the lower end.

I built an engine for my 1985 F250 to tow my 32-ft race trailer so I built the combo with improved low speed power in mind.  Also, it is more often driven by itself (ie, not towing) and I like to drive that 4-speed truck in a spirited manner.  Wanting the best of both worlds, the engine is intentionally one giant compromise to cover both possiblities.  And so in order to maintain some low speed torque but also have some upper rpm breathability, I did this:



That's a standard factory iron intake manifold to which I machined away the 4-hole carb pad's holes and made more of an aftermarket dual plane opening with divider.  The opening is "half clover leaf" because some of the areas of the factory carb pad fall below the machined plane.  The factory 1985 EGR plate (grey) is machined from a 4-hole plate to an open spacer (also half clover leaf). It is 0.850" thick, and so I now have an 0.850" thick open spacer atop an opened up dual plane intake manifold. All parts are stock, all emissions plumbing hooks up, truck passes smog with flying colors, has more power than stock, and gets better mpg than stock.

Currently I am at 13.44 mpg with factory exhaust, worn out tires and front end. I expect 14+ mpg with new tires and 16-17 mpg with the ZF-5 speed and addition of a free-flowing exhaust system (not towing).

Paul

P.S.: With the stock exhaust and stock emissions carb, the engine does not pull hard to 5500 rpm, but the engine is corked up at both ends and I feel certain that if I added a Holley 750 and dual exhaust it would transform the engine's top end behavior.
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  racinghabbit on January 22nd 2014, 2:08 pm

I can run an aftermarket intake... I'm just really tight on money right now but still want to play this summer... Paul you post is very helpful... sometimes seeing is better..

not 100% of what i am going to do but i am getting close
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  supervel45 on January 22nd 2014, 9:38 pm

Paul Kane wrote:
racinghabbit wrote:if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj.. I have a c8, d1, d3 , and one off a 87 f250...running 1500-5500...stock e7 truck heads ... with bigger cam and springs...
The standard iron passenger car intakes (such as the C8, etc) and performance factory intakes (such as SCJ & PI, etc) are completely different animals. None of them are perfect choices for 1500-5500 rpm in a stock stroke, moderate compression 460 such as the parts combinaton you describe.   With the factory standard intakes, breathability falls off long before 5500 rpm, and with the performance intakes' low speed torque/power falls off at the lower end.

I built an engine for my 1985 F250 to tow my 32-ft race trailer so I built the combo with improved low speed power in mind.  Also, it is more often driven by itself (ie, not towing) and I like to drive that 4-speed truck in a spirited manner.  Wanting the best of both worlds, the engine is intentionally one giant compromise to cover both possiblities.  And so in order to maintain some low speed torque but also have some upper rpm breathability, I did this:



That's a standard factory iron intake manifold to which I machined away the 4-hole carb pad's holes and made more of an aftermarket dual plane opening with divider.  The opening is "half clover leaf" because some of the areas of the factory carb pad fall below the machined plane.  The factory 1985 EGR plate (grey) is machined from a 4-hole plate to an open spacer (also half clover leaf). It is 0.850" thick, and so I now have an 0.850" thick open spacer atop an opened up dual plane intake manifold. All parts are stock, all emissions plumbing hooks up, truck passes smog with flying colors, has more power than stock, and gets better mpg than stock.

Currently I am at 13.44 mpg with factory exhaust, worn out tires and front end. I expect 14+ mpg with new tires and 16-17 mpg with the ZF-5 speed and addition of a free-flowing exhaust system (not towing).

Paul

P.S.: With the stock exhaust and stock emissions carb, the engine does not pull hard to 5500 rpm, but the engine is corked up at both ends and I feel certain that if I added a Holley 750 and dual exhaust it would transform the engine's top end behavior.
Paul, Have you ever tried this trick with a SCJ intake and carb spacer and if so what where the results?

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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  69F100 on January 22nd 2014, 10:01 pm

racinghabbit wrote:I can run an aftermarket intake... I'm just really tight on money right now but still want to play this summer... Paul you post is very helpful... sometimes seeing is better..

not 100% of what i am going to do but i am getting close

Punch in 460ford on ebay some times you can run across aftermarket intakes cheap for less than $125 used
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Re: if you had to run a stock intake manifold, what is the best casting to use other than the scj

Post  racinghabbit on January 22nd 2014, 11:41 pm

paul, Do you have the measurment you cut that out too?
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