Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

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Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 5:21 pm

Embarassed ... So I finally was able to hook up the oil pressure gage to the back of the block, tapped the manifold for vacuum, bought a timing light and started the engine ran for maybe 3 minutes and noticed 0 oil pressure, turned it off and thought it was the really old autometer gauge. Took off the line and started the engine, no oil came out of the back.

So I've ran this engine about 8 or 9 times for about 5 min max, without oil press. I took out the dizzy and didn't see the shaft, Dont know if it fell or wasn't there to begin with  No .

Did I damage something? The pump is installed and there's about 7 quarts of oil but nothing was pumping it up.. I'm hoping she will run fine with a new driveshaft, on the last run I saw some smoke out of the valve covers.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  HEMI-HUNTER on March 11th 2014, 5:40 pm

I would bet your bearings are fried. you may want to change the bearings first, rod and mains before you really hurt the crank I wouldn't start the motor back up.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  69F100 on March 11th 2014, 5:59 pm

X2. Atleast pull the pan and have alook at the bearing you might even find your missing oil pump drive I WOULD NOT START IT AGAIN until I checked the bottom end out good.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:05 pm

This sucks, I Dont think I have enough clearance to pull the pan.

I just remembered that I had an oil leak at the back of the manifold, doesn't this mean that oil was being pulled to the top of the motor?? It would leak a lot with the engine running.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:17 pm

Even if it DID actually have oil pressure during your startup...if there's no pump shaft visible, the pan has to come off so you can:

1. Find the missing shaft if there is one.
2. Pop off the main and rod bearing caps to check for bearing damage and replace as necessary.
3. Correctly install a pump shaft WITH RETAINER RING to avoid making this a habit.

Oh...and while the engine is out,

4. fixing that oil leak will be a snap. Smile

Oh, and don't forget to get your hands on a known working oil pressure gauge and PRIME the oiling system by spinning the pump before you drop the distributer back in. That way you'll know before you go.


Last edited by maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:23 pm

Lol.. I fixed the leak already  lol! . If the bearing went what are the symptoms? Would I have metal shavings in the oil? I have a magnetic drain plug.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:25 pm

If you fixed the leak, that must mean you fired it up again...otherwise you just think you fixed it. Did it have oil pressure? How much?
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:36 pm

No I meant i fixed it about a week ago, since then I've started the engine twice without a pressure gauge since I didn't have the right fittings. It Dont leak out the back anymore.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:37 pm

How can it have oil up top without the drive shaft? Is it just oil slopping around?

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:37 pm

You're still starting it without a pump shaft???
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:38 pm

maverick wrote:With or without a pump driveshaft??

I'm pretty sure it had no shaft. Max time running was today about 5 minutes.
Edit:: no I haven't started again since I posted this which was when I found out I had no shaft.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:44 pm

Keep it up and you won't need to pull the pan...you can just scrap it in one big lump.

If it has a pump shaft, FIND OUT WHAT OIL PRESSURE YOU HAVE and go from there.

If it has no pump shaft, pull the pan and do it right.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:47 pm

Sorry for the confusion. I have not started it again.

I have no shaft, I ordered one on amazon. When it gets here can I prime the pump and see how much psi I get without starting?

How much psi should I be seeing to kind of tell if everything is ok or not?

Thanks for the help guys.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:49 pm

N
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:55 pm

Yes, you can spin the pump without starting the engine...Make that a HABIT anytime you fire one up for the first time.

If it was mine, the pan would come off. You've surely hurt some parts in there.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 6:56 pm

Bearings are pretty cheap when compared with cranks, rods, cams, etc....
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 6:58 pm

maverick wrote:Yes, you can spin the pump without starting the engine...Make that a HABIT anytime you fire one up for the first time.

If it was mine, the pan would come off.  You've surely hurt some parts in there.

Ok noted, thanks for the information.

Can I replace bearings with the pan off? Without removing the engine??.. I ask because maybe I could drop the subframe.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  jasonf on March 11th 2014, 7:01 pm

So let me get this straight.
You ran the thing for who knows how long with no oil pressure.
You may or may not have ever had an oil pump drive because you are not sure if it was there or just vanished into thin air.
You don't want to pull the engine to check all the damage you probably have done already and to see if the oil pump drive is in there.
You are just going to drop a new oil pump drive in without ever checking on all the stuff you already fubared.
You have more plenty of money and are looking forward to stimulating the economy.

And last but not least,
you are going to keep asking the same question till someone gives you the answer you want to hear instead of reality so here goes.

I would drop in a new shaft and fire that bad boy up. A little bearing material never hurt anybody. Take her for a rip and giver a good workout. Then pull the filter and cut it in half and see how she all looks. I'm sure you will be alright because bearings are just going to wear out anyways.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 7:03 pm

Before worrying about replacing bearings, you better see if there's any damage to the crank.. BTW, are we dealing with a flat tappet cam here?
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 7:04 pm

maverick wrote:Before worrying about replacing bearings, you better see if there's any damage to the crank..  BTW, are we dealing with a flat tappet cam here?

Yes flat tappet.

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 7:05 pm

This is all pointing to....PULL IT OUT.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 7:10 pm

Ok just went under the car, looks like there's enough room to pull the pan if I remove the front sway bar.

After I remove the pan, what's the first thing to check?

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  maverick on March 11th 2014, 7:19 pm

Pull off a couple of main caps and rod caps and show the bearings to someone who knows what he's looking at. Be sure to note their positions because they'll have to go back together IN THE SAME POSITIONS, ...assuming you're going to put it back together in the car. I have my doubts.

If you've been running it with no oil pressure, that cam and lifters probably ain't happy either.

At the risk of being repetitive, If it was mine it would be on an engine stand.
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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  MiamiSC on March 11th 2014, 7:25 pm

Ok thanks.. Ill look at the bearings and take some pictures for you guys.

I know the right thing to do it so pull the motor, I just really would hate to do that, it was such a pain to put the damn thing with that huge c6 in it by myself. I'll keep you guys posted, thanks for not being so rough on me  Cool 

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Re: Did not notice there was no oil pump drive shaft.

Post  rmcomprandy on March 11th 2014, 7:45 pm

This would all depend upon whether or not the engine saw some real heat and how good of an assembly lube was used.
Take it out and disassemble the whole thing and inspect it right, then start over.
If a piston with recommended tight clearances was used, my concern would be cylinder walls and pistons skirt scuffing.

EDIT: You will know EXACTLY what got hurt and what didn't and replace what is needed ... you'll sleep better afterward.


Last edited by rmcomprandy on March 11th 2014, 7:53 pm; edited 2 times in total

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