Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

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Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 17th 2014, 7:56 pm

Hello ready to finish my build and needing advise on which way to go about building this motor, I'm wanting to build a max effort street friendly drag car on pump gas.

The Car is a 1990 Foxbody Gt.  
 
1. Ford A460 block bore 4.600 or a 4.625
2. Eagle 4.500 crank
3. Eagle 6.800 rods
4. Trick flow A460 2.350 heads
5. Trick flow A460 intake
6. Quick fuel 1450 cfm Carburetor
7. Diamond piston. I don't have the piston ordered at this time, what would be a good compression for this build on pump gas?
8. 3 speed Transmission
9. 27 inch rear tires
what rear end gears would work good with this combination also needing a custom roller cam for this build.


Last edited by CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 9:31 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  rmcomprandy on March 17th 2014, 8:45 pm

CHARLIEB wrote:Hello ready to finish my build and needing advise on which way to go about building this motor, I'm wanting to build a max effort street friendly drag car on pump gas.

The Car is a 1990 Foxbody Gt.  
 
1. Ford A460 block bore 4.600 or a 4.625
2. Eagle 4.500 crank
3. Eagle 6.800 rods
4. Trick flow A460 2.350 heads
5. Trick flow A460 intake
6. Quick fuel 1450 cfm Carburetor
7. Diamond piston. I don't have the piston ordered at this time, what would be a good compression for this build on pump gas?
8. 3 speed Transmission
9. 27 inch rear tires
what rear end gears would work good with this combination also needing a custom roller cam for this build.

You're probably looking at around 850 horsepower and almost that much torque with a street friendly, pump gas engine just under 11/1 compression ratio.
You probably won't need a 3 speed trans.

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CDMBill on March 18th 2014, 1:25 am

Define max effort? Randy has laid out a practical approach. You can make more power, with decreasing longevity, how fast do you want to go? For roughly twice the money you can get 1000 hp.

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Rear end gearing/Transmission Combos

Post  supervel45 on March 18th 2014, 2:10 am

I agree with Randy with the 3 spead trans. statement. A 2speed Glide type transmission, will be best, esp. at the track. If you do go 3 speed, I would keep the rear gears high. Around 3.0 to 3.25. Traction on the street will be hard to come by, and a 2 speed with the higher 1st gear ratio, may help there. Gas mileage was not mentioned, but the high gears will help that also, but I don't think you are to worried about that, with a large engine, like this one. Highway driving is something to consider, if you plan on doing much or any. When you get a cam chosen, let whoever helps you, are what you decide to go with, relect on the rear end gear choice also (RPM Through Traps) You did not say if you are going to run 1/8 or 1/4 mile? Weight of Vechicle usually plays a part with a 2 speed, but with an engine this large in a full weight Stang, it should not be a problem, but I did not see it mentioned? That should be considered also. Sounds like a nice ride coming together.

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  windsor on March 18th 2014, 12:01 pm

Thinking that carb would be a tad large for your goals? Maybe a 1250 would suffice.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  psfracer on March 18th 2014, 4:21 pm

My first thought was "max effort" and "pump gas" don't go together, unless you can run E85.  Is that possible for you?  If you can, you can raise the compression a bunch. Plus I would go with a 28 tall tire if possible, especially if you will be going with a 3 speed trans.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 7:23 pm

You're probably looking at around 850 horsepower and almost that much torque with a street friendly, pump gas engine just under 11/1 compression ratio.
You probably won't need a 3 speed trans.[/quote]

Thanks Randy, Those numbers sound great to me. I was looking for a three speed for gas mileage reason. The car will be driven only weekends for meantime until I get the rear end I want next year and then track time.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  chuck on March 18th 2014, 7:39 pm

598 and 1450 carb.........don't go together with gas mileage either. Wink 

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 7:44 pm

supervel45 wrote:I agree with Randy with the 3 spead trans. statement. A 2speed Glide type transmission, will be best, esp. at the track. If you do go 3 speed, I would keep the rear gears high. Around 3.0 to 3.25. Traction on the street will be hard to come by, and a 2 speed with the higher 1st gear ratio, may help there. Gas mileage was not mentioned, but the high gears will help that also, but I don't think you are to worried about that, with a large engine, like this one. Highway driving is something to consider, if you plan on doing much or any. When you get a cam chosen, let whoever helps you, are what you decide to go with, relect on the rear end gear choice also (RPM Through Traps) You did not say if you are going to run 1/8 or 1/4 mile? Weight of Vechicle usually plays a part with a 2 speed, but with an engine this large in a full weight Stang, it should not be a problem, but I did not see it mentioned? That should be considered also. Sounds like a nice ride coming together.

Supervel45......... Well I was wanting a three speed for local driving in town on weekends I also was looking on the Moser site and the 3.0 gears is what I was thinking. The car will have full weight and not gutted. I am looking at 1/4 mile runs when I am ready for the track. Thank you for the complement and the help much appreciated. I don't plan on running the car on the highway because of high RPM's. Yes I think traction is going to be my biggest problem.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 7:50 pm

psfracer wrote:My first thought was "max effort" and "pump gas" don't go together, unless you can run E85.  Is that possible for you?  If you can, you can raise the compression a bunch.  Plus I would go with a 28 tall tire if possible, especially if you will be going with a 3 speed trans.

Hello psfracer, I am looking for the max horsepower that I can get out of this motor on pump gas most likely 93 octane. I will have to see about exchanging the carburetor and might be a problem since I have had it over a year now. I will look into 28 inch tires on don't want to raise the rear end up to much as possible.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 7:53 pm

CDMBill wrote:Define max effort? Randy has laid out a practical approach. You can make more power, with decreasing longevity, how fast do you want to go? For roughly twice the money you can get 1000 hp.

Hey Bill... I want much power I can get out of this engine so if I can I get 1000hp that would be fine as well.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 7:53 pm

Okay here is the full story behind this motor.
First I got caught up like most people who read magazines and dream of having a motor like you see them build. This car was not intend to be a race car but a car to go fast and a daily driver. I did not know about all aspects behind building a big motor as this one from the start then after buying parts and then I realized that I had made a big mistake because this was something I did not figure out and plan all the way through to tell you the truth.

But now I have all the parts just needing pistons and oil pump and block bored it's a go. The one magazine I was looking at was the one Mr. kasse had built some time back a Boss nine 589ci 10.5 to 1) and a 273/280 roller cam, the engine made 973 HP and 800 FT/LBS
I also get a lot of static from my friends because they all drive GM. I go to the local hang out once a month and mostly GM cars very few Fords. So I want to let them know what can be had out of an A460 motor. I have been a ford man since a teenager when buying my first mustang back in 1988. since then I have owned three mustangs and three Lincolns. Ford pride here to stay !

I guess this is more pride then anything and this means a lot to me to set this car apart from the rest.
Later on I will buy a notchback and set this motor in it and tube it out to be an all pump gas pro street. The sad thing I did find a notchback in Ft. Worth that was in good shape with a four banger for a 1000.00 I should have gone to go it.

So, I want to say thank you for all your comments and help it is greatly appreciated.


Last edited by CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 8:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  rmcomprandy on March 18th 2014, 8:17 pm

CDMBill wrote:Define max effort? Randy has laid out a practical approach. You can make more power, with decreasing longevity, how fast do you want to go? For roughly twice the money you can get 1000 hp.

To Me, when someone says "max effort" it doesn't mean the fastest, most powerful, highest revving or most exotic but, the best it can possibly be for that specific purpose it is supposed to perform.

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 18th 2014, 8:35 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
CDMBill wrote:Define max effort? Randy has laid out a practical approach. You can make more power, with decreasing longevity, how fast do you want to go? For roughly twice the money you can get 1000 hp.

To Me, when someone says "max effort" it doesn't mean the fastest, most powerful, highest revving or most exotic but, the best it can possibly be for that specific purpose it is supposed to perform.

Randy, You are absolutely right. I do appreciate all the advise you have given me.
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Camshaft

Post  supervel45 on March 18th 2014, 10:14 pm

So did you go with the same cam in the Kaase article? The duration sounds pretty good for a big inch street build. The lift was not noted, either? I went back and see you want a custom roller. So I don't know if you bought a cam, and changed your mind about it, and want to go custom now?

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  Frank Merkl on March 19th 2014, 2:11 am

the car Kaase built, 589 Boss mustang, all I can say , it' s a fun car to drive !! a buddy of mine bought it !!
Frank
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  Calypso on March 19th 2014, 2:32 am

Frank Merkl wrote:the car Kaase built, 589 Boss mustang, all I can say , it' s a fun car to drive !! a buddy of mine bought it !!
Frank

My buddy went to visit Kaase's shop while he was over that side of the pond. Talked with him about that car and Jon said he would actually prefer a smaller cid Boss in a street car. Said 589 is actually a bit of a pain to use in practise, 'cause it's so easily sideways in any gear when you blip the throttle.  Smile  How about that, more is not always the best in all applications, from The Man. Very Happy

-Janne

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  supervel45 on March 19th 2014, 3:27 am

You will definitly need a heavy throttle return spring, so you can control that blip. Suspect 

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  Calypso on March 19th 2014, 4:40 am

I know, one of those stories.  Cool  Sorry, didn't mean to sideline the discussion too much.

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  supervel45 on March 19th 2014, 6:55 am

The Boss 9 had a manual 6 speed, I thought. That would be a little hairier than an automatic, but either will be a handful. I have run slicks with an auto and IFS on the street with at least a couple of hundred less horepower, and you have to be on your game to keep it strait, and between the ditches. It can be done with radials and a manual transmissions, as I have a couple of friends that run high RPM small blocks, and I have seen them lay two strait black marks for a long ways, to 4th gear. They have alot of practice at it though, and well set up cars. Even though the cam mentioned is for the Boss9 the .050" duration is not bad for a street grind with your combo. Get with someone around here and they can set you up with a custom cam, once they have all you other spec's. The E-85 suggestion was spot on if you can get it. Just remember you will burn more alky than gas, when you figure cost per mile.

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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 8:35 pm

supervel45 wrote:So did you go with the same cam in the Kaase article? The duration sounds pretty good for a big inch street build. The lift was not noted, either? I went back and see you want a custom roller. So I don't know if you bought a cam, and changed your mind about it, and want to go custom now?

I have not bought a cam at this time. My buddy is going to CC the heads first for the pistons and the camshaft will be the last thing we will focus on. I know sometime back he said we could get about 900 hp out of this motor on pump gas and be a daily driver. He has a Chevy Camaro with a Pontiac motor max out making over 600 hp and drives it on the street with no problems.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 8:39 pm

Frank Merkl wrote:the car Kaase built, 589 Boss mustang, all I can say , it' s a fun car to drive !! a buddy of mine bought it !!
Frank

Yes I figure it would be fun to drive so that is why I'm building mine as they say different strokes for different folks. Man your friend is one lucky person to have bought that car. I was trying to make mine stealth as well but with the large intake its not going to happen.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 8:41 pm

Calypso wrote:
Frank Merkl wrote:the car Kaase built, 589 Boss mustang, all I can say , it' s a fun car to drive !! a buddy of mine bought it !!
Frank

My buddy went to visit Kaase's shop while he was over that side of the pond. Talked with him about that car and Jon said he would actually prefer a smaller cid Boss in a street car. Said 589 is actually a bit of a pain to use in practise, 'cause it's so easily sideways in any gear when you blip the throttle.  Smile  How about that, more is not always the best in all applications, from The Man. Very Happy

-Janne

Yes I have heard that before about wanting to go sideways, So I will have to see what will be the trade off
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 8:43 pm

supervel45 wrote:You will definitly need a heavy throttle return spring, so you can control that blip. Suspect 

Yes maybe that will be required as well. I cant wait to finish my Build. He really don't like ford but he is excited to build my motor. I guess mine will be next after will rebuild my friends th350 transmission.
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Re: Needing advise on a 598ci street friendly drag radial Foxbody on pump gas

Post  CHARLIEB on March 19th 2014, 8:45 pm

Calypso wrote:I know, one of those stories.  Cool  Sorry, didn't mean to sideline the discussion too much.

No you did not sideline the discussion at all. I am very glad to have people post comments on this post. feel free to comment. I thank you for your response.
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