Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 12:23 pm

gmsmkr wrote:A stock 2 bolt block will hold all you want with scj heads and pump gas.

As for a carb QF dommy 1050 or 1250 will work good

Dave De wrote:Factory 2 bolt blocks work for me up to around 650-700 hp. The carb wont have much to do with street manners as the cam grind will. Glad that you are onto a rotating assembly with good rods and crank. Make sure that your piston valve reliefs match your heads.

maverick wrote:I've driven cars that would light 'em up in any gear, pretty much any speed.  In such cases, one would be advised to employ some sort of progressive throttle linkage instead of a toggle switch.  That way the car only does what the right foot tells it to do.

All positive information to the questions asked, I will not buy the pistons until the heads in my possession, the cam will not be figured out until the body is finalized gear/tire/converter combinations are figured out, and as for the linkage X2 with redundant backup(no sticky throttle)
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  maverick on September 5th 2014, 12:34 pm

maverick wrote:I've driven cars that would light 'em up in any gear, pretty much any speed.  In such cases, one would be advised to employ some sort of progressive throttle linkage instead of a toggle switch.  That way the car only does what the right foot tells it to do.

I was being a bit of a smartass there. Wink Just my way of saying that one can have gawdawful power on tap without being sideways all the time. A little bit of judgement and restraint..... Cool
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 12:53 pm

maverick wrote:
maverick wrote:I've driven cars that would light 'em up in any gear, pretty much any speed.  In such cases, one would be advised to employ some sort of progressive throttle linkage instead of a toggle switch.  That way the car only does what the right foot tells it to do.

I was being a bit of a smartass there. Wink   Just my way of saying that one can have gawdawful power on tap without being sideways all the time. A little bit of judgement and restraint..... Cool

Yes, I think we all know the conversation, and the potential dangers especially to others if you don't use the proper judgement and restraint, and like have all overlooked that at one point or another. I am a far cry from 20 yrs. old this would have gotten me an obit at that age. Additional dialogue pertaining to the build and what my reasoning is, are things like time available to go to the track (limited), cruise meets are many close to home in the summer, the bodies I have been considering are mostly 8.50- 9.50 legal cars with narrowed rearends, when I do get the opportunity to cruiz to the Friday night heads up street races I didn't want to get eaten by every ricer with a turbo. As for the redundant throttle linkage springs I've seen some genius' that would use the spring out of a bic pen.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  Dark Horse of Apocalypse on September 5th 2014, 12:53 pm

To the OP do you have access to E-85? If you do I am sure one of the sites vendors could hook ya up with an Eagle Rotating Assembly for 70CC heads giving you a 13:1 CR with 501 CID.

Just my $.02. Wink
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  maverick on September 5th 2014, 12:57 pm

No reference to the springs, there.... just pure sarcasm. Sorry. Embarassed

Just don't drive this thing on a damp road. Don't ask how I know. Rolling Eyes
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 1:39 pm

maverick wrote:No reference to the springs, there.... just pure sarcasm.  Sorry. Embarassed

Just don't drive this thing on a damp road.  Don't ask how I know. Rolling Eyes

No need for Sorry I appreciate the advice
Agreed comfortably (or uncomfortably) sideways belongs on the track affraid

I think I can play with the gearing a little too to make it a little bit of a slug out of the hole, unless of course the RPM activated nitrous is turned on;)
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  the Coug on September 5th 2014, 2:01 pm

Mav what most of these guys don't understand is Humidity, dampness, dust on the road, almost anything will loose the traction, and the torque is 100% of the time not just when you want it....
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  maverick on September 5th 2014, 2:09 pm

Years ago I road tested a '69 Mach 1 (with an honest 700 hp) after some carb tuning and timing changes. The car was on 1969 era leaf spring suspension and E.T Street tires. During the brief road test, a light rain shower fell.

When I got home, I opened the door, rolled out of the car and kissed the ground. Rolling Eyes

Whatever you build, good luck and have fun. But if the sun ain't shining, park it.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 2:25 pm

the Coug wrote:Mav what most of these guys don't understand is Humidity, dampness, dust on the road,  almost anything will loose the traction, and the torque is 100% of the time not just when you want it....

What exactly is "these guys" I understand humidity, dampness, dust, oil, antifreeze, and just about everything else than can fall out of a vehicle or leak out of the under maintained junk that everywhere on the streets, not to mention where I live there is snow / ice on the roads for 8-months of the year you would be surprised how many experienced drivers can't make it around the block with winter tires and an AWD vehicle Shocked Maybe it would be more helpful (at least to me) to address the thread which was a 9-10 sec capable street car w/nitrous(on a prepped track) built with a body/chassis legal for 8.50 - 9.50 (without the junk internals) that runs on pump gas. Does the 528 Cu/in. make sense, is the 10:1 compression ratio reasonable, what should the real HP goal be and how much left in reserve to dial up the nitrous...etc.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  maverick on September 5th 2014, 2:57 pm

Sorry for any unintended hijack.

IMO, it's all very do-able, and been done many times over. If it was me (and it isn't) I'd omit anything that doesn't make it go, stop, steer or keep me from being killed. That's how I think in keeping weight down and minimizing the need for hp/money. Like Dad said, "If you want to go somewhere in a hurry, don't take a lot of crap with you." Laughing

Just for reference, I can point to an '88 Ranger with ladder bars and a pump gas friendly 514. At 2700 lbs. race weight, it went 9.27. It would be a crappy street machine, but yeah....you can do this.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 3:43 pm

maverick wrote:Sorry for any unintended hijack.

IMO, it's all very do-able, and been done many times over.  If it was me (and it isn't) I'd omit anything that doesn't make it go, stop, steer or keep me from being killed.  That's how I think in keeping weight down and minimizing the need for hp/money.    Like Dad said, "If you want to go somewhere in a hurry, don't take a lot of crap with you." Laughing

Just for reference, I can point to an '88 Ranger with ladder bars and a pump gas friendly 514.   At 2700 lbs. race weight, it went 9.27.  It would be a crappy street machine, but yeah....you can do this.

Again nothing to be Sorry for I am just looking for insights from experienced BBF users/builders

Only 2- of the bodies are 8.50 cert cars (1-18.5x33 - 1-10.5), 1- is not completed yet, built to be a street driven car (albeit small block car) the 10.5 car was streeted also the other 3- are in the 9.50 legal which were all street driven real 600+ HP cars full interior 3200-3500lbs. We have our share of 7.50-8.50 cars on the street twin twin turbos and huffers, that is not what I am trying to build. The short summers, distance from the track, and limited time have led me to this idea. I am not angry just responding passionately to the topic because it is important to me, although I am a newby on this forum I do respect the knowledge and experience of its members and will consider all pertinent information, and do appreciate the participation... and the smart azz comments too!
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  QtrWarrior on September 5th 2014, 5:28 pm

Falcon,

I think some of these guys think everyone that wants to build a high HP street car is an idiot.. Rolling Eyes
I think what they also fail to realize is that some people have common sense.. Shocked

I had the same discussion with a friend of mine , who's 500hp Porsche "scared him"..
It's all about responsibility and careful use of the right foot..affraid

Build it  and be safe !

Oh and I have also driven 750hp + "street cars"..
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  Dave De on September 5th 2014, 6:23 pm

Hey Falcon,
We are similar, my pro-street runs 9.20s in good air at 148mph on motor and the street cant take the power but at the track I could use a shot to put it into the 8s. I cant put my foot to the wood without it going up in smoke even at 70mph.
I wonder how these street racers do it. They must have aluminum small blocks to reduce the nose weight.

If my track was an hour away I'd still trailer it.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 7:10 pm

QtrWarrior wrote:Falcon,

I think some of these guys think everyone that wants to build a high HP street car is an idiot.. Rolling Eyes
I think what they also fail to realize is that some people have common sense.. Shocked

I had the same discussion with a friend of mine , who's 500hp Porsche "scared him"..
It's all about responsibility and careful use of the right foot..affraid

Build it  and be safe !

Oh and I have also driven 750hp + "street cars"..

We all have different ideal cars, usages, and budgets.

I will build it, and be safe in reality I am far more worried for all the spoon fed kids who turn 16 and daddy buys them a 5.0 mustang and has the supercharger installed at the local dealership that is a combination that far too often ends badly.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 7:18 pm

Dave De wrote:Hey Falcon,
We are similar, my pro-street runs 9.20s in good air at 148mph on motor and the street cant take the power but at the track I could use a shot to put it into the 8s. I cant put my foot to the wood without it going up in smoke even at 70mph.
I wonder how these street racers do it. They must have aluminum small blocks to reduce the nose weight.

If my track was an hour away I'd still trailer it.

Similar maybe, but i'm sure I will be in the ground before I see the 8s. as for the street guys from what I have seen they should have sponsors, why you need your chassis guy, full pit crew, Lenco, throttle stop and no Bus at the other end to race at night down a back road...not quite sure ...its not for me.

As for the track I have moved away from the local car guru buddy's who were always adpt to help out at the local track, now it's a one man deal the wife doesn't drive and it's a lot of work for the occasional Friday night heads up racing.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  rmcomprandy on September 5th 2014, 8:30 pm

FalconEh wrote:
dfree383 wrote:I've built a number of cheap builds.....

Don't skimp on the rods, use as light as affordable piston and please do not use cheap valve train parts..... You get what you pay for in valve train parts.

Agreed, would I be better with an Eagle 501 cast crank and 4340 H-beam rods rather than the offset ground as I know of these available locally on a abandoned project (new parts)

Personally, I think an offset ground FORD OEM nodular crankshaft is a better piece than a China cast steel crankshaft of any brand but, they would work. An H-beam rod is just more over kill unless you have a forged crankshaft.

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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 8:40 pm

FalconEh wrote:Okay, so junk the internals! Budget build is out run one of the 473's as is for now if necessary . However there is still a few question marks, this is going to be a street/strip car and if I am going to do the 4340 Crank/4340 H-beam rods, forged pistons, I would still like to stick with the 4.3" crank, the rod ratio is better for those set on kill nights with nitrous, and I likely will use -38 cc pistons for approx. 10:1 pump gas (++for nitrous) motor. This now is going to require the SCJ aluminum heads but still have the streetable carb question among others. How much can the OEM blocks handle before you need to move up to the FRPP block, and will this combination likely get me there with a relatively reliable combination.  

rmcomprandy wrote:
FalconEh wrote:
dfree383 wrote:I've built a number of cheap builds.....

Don't skimp on the rods, use as light as affordable piston and please do not use cheap valve train parts..... You get what you pay for in valve train parts.

Agreed, would I be better with an Eagle 501 cast crank and 4340 H-beam rods rather than the offset ground as I know of these available locally on a abandoned project (new parts)

Personally, I think an offset ground FORD OEM nodular crankshaft is a better piece than a China cast steel crankshaft of any brand but, they would work.  An H-beam rod is just more over kill unless you have a forged crankshaft.

Thanks randy what are your thoughts on the 4.3" forged SCAT package listed above in the stock block .060 over with the SCJ heads1050 dominator and a likely heavily nitroused at the track:?:

OH Yeah Harley For Sale (sorry wrong thread)
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  gmsmkr on September 5th 2014, 8:51 pm

If it was a build that would be my personal use and small budget I would do a 501 stroker with a 6.7 aluminum rod light weight forged pistons (flat top) with frpp scj heads some head work with back cut valves a custom solid roller and a plate kit set around 200 and have some fun with great manners and it will get mean on the hose.... this is if it was a build for me for a street/strip combo.

Good luck with your build and be safe Cool
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  the Coug on September 5th 2014, 9:01 pm

if you are going to build a stroker why so small? it takes the same money to build a 501 as a 514,521,533,545,552,or a 557 so build one big enough
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  gmsmkr on September 5th 2014, 9:07 pm

the Coug wrote:if you are going to build a stroker why so small? it takes the same money to build a 501 as a 514,521,533,545,552,or a 557 so build one big enough

I'm more of a big bore short stroke guy not much on big strokers
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 9:12 pm

the Coug wrote:if you are going to build a stroker why so small? it takes the same money to build a 501 as a 514,521,533,545,552,or a 557 so build one big enough

Well here I am not the authority (more of a cleveland guy same design but smaller), but it will see alot of street duty and will be heavily nitroused, I do not want to spend the money on an FRPP block as I have 2-Stock .060 over 473s. I want to run on pump gas (on the street anyway) and contrary to popular belief in my experience the rod ratio does play a part especially when running lots of laugh gas it increases the side load angle and premeturaly wears out the cylinders this has been more evident the lower the rod ratio or the larger the stroker, taller blocks can make up for it but it is not an option in my case.
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  FalconEh on September 5th 2014, 9:18 pm

gmsmkr wrote:If it was a build that would be my personal use and small budget I would do a 501 stroker with a 6.7 aluminum rod light weight forged pistons (flat top) with frpp scj heads some head work with back cut valves a custom solid roller and a plate kit set around 200 and have some fun with great manners and it will get mean on the hose.... this is if it was a build for me for a street/strip combo.

Good luck with your build and be safe Cool

Viable but, aluminum rods on a pump gas motor???, most of the people that I know that run them are track only and tear down their motors while I am getting a hamburger at the concession
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  gmsmkr on September 5th 2014, 9:27 pm



Last edited by gmsmkr on September 5th 2014, 9:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  the Coug on September 5th 2014, 9:28 pm

Hey if you are so worried about rod ratio maybe you should stick to the Clevelands. like I said Rod ratios are over rated, I repeat ROD RATIOS ARE OVER RATED if you want a high rod ratio build a 3.59 stroke with a 4.44 bore piston with a 6.8 rod then you will have a big ratio, you seem to think they are so important....
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Re: Budget Street/Strip Stroker Build Advice w/ Existing Parts plus???

Post  the Coug on September 5th 2014, 9:35 pm

and now before you get all twisted out of shape I have run Clevelands and still have a few on the stand. Most of us guys have had them and some of us still do....
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