Ford 460 overheating

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

Go down

Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 8:59 am

I have a Ford 460 out of a 1970 lincoln in my 1979 bronco.

I know very little about history of the engine as I purchased the bronco on ebay and they engine was in the truck when I bought, the PO stated it had a 351m and didn't even know the engine had been swapped.

Only modifications to the engine:

Edelbrock Performer 460 Intake
MSD Atomic EFI
Electric FAN (removed mech fan as there was no shroud).
New plugs/wires and dizzy cap/rotor.
Changed the oil and flushed the coolant and replaced. New Thermostat and New Radiator cap.

Issue:
engine is showing signs of overheating at low temps. I will start getting boil over at around 195 out the radiator drain hose. It just recently started this. I have tried burping the system with no change. This is also the reason I installed the electric fan that made no difference.

Any thoughts or insight would be appreciated.

Thanks
Edwin










FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  maverick on July 30th 2015, 10:43 am

Is the radiator overfilled? It needs a pocket of air up top to allow for expansion (expansion tanks are just that). Without one, an overfilled radiator will spit at a low temp.

Otherwise, be sure the fan is well shrouded (that's a big one) and the gauge is accurate.
avatar
maverick
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 3051
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 66

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 11:22 am

maverick wrote:Is the radiator overfilled?  It needs a pocket of air up top to allow for expansion (expansion tanks are just that).  Without one, an overfilled radiator will spit at a low temp.

Otherwise, be sure the fan is well shrouded (that's a big one) and the gauge is accurate.



I will make sure it isn't overfilled, I did fill it up. The engine is def heating up. Most of these problems began after I installed the new intake. Maybe between the intake and MSD Atomic I installed it was to much for the old head gaskets or something else.

It had been running in the 190/191 range. (Per my msd handheld ect readings). Yesterday when I flushed the system again and did a really good radiator rinse out.

I cranked the engine with a funnel in place of the radiator cap with fluid about 1/3 way up the funnel to make sure I was getting all the air out of the system. It did stablize at 190/191 for about 15 minutes then it started to rise again. When I shut it down the manual gauge on the dash cluster was readying H, and the MSD Handheld was reading 221.

It is stored in a garage and I have noticed some fluid/mist coming from the drivers side exhaust on start up, At first I just assumed it had to do with this awful florida heat and humidity. Now I am more suspect of maybe a head gasket failure or cracked head. Other than checking the oil for water those are issues I am not as familiar with trying to troubleshoot.




FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  maverick on July 30th 2015, 2:22 pm

Have you pressurized the system to check for leaks?
avatar
maverick
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 3051
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 66

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 2:34 pm

maverick wrote:Have you pressurized the system to check for leaks?

I have not and have never performed this.

Can I assume I can use just use my air a safety nozzle and put air in through the overflow hose and listen for leaks?

Or would I need to rig up a pressure gauge and load the system to a certain psi and see how long it holds for?

Would I actually hear a leak if it was a cracked hear or bad head gasket?


I do appreciate the information being provided.




FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 3:37 pm

I pressurized the system, it held pressure for 45 minutes and seemed to have no loss in pressure.


Coolant level currently is about 1/2" below the radiator neck.


FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  maverick on July 30th 2015, 3:58 pm

Do you periodically notice any coolant loss other than the boilover?
avatar
maverick
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 3051
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 66

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  supervel45 on July 30th 2015, 4:38 pm

Did you check the thermostat?

supervel45

Posts : 3070
Join date : 2013-09-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 5:05 pm

maverick wrote:Do you periodically notice any coolant loss other than the boilover?

No

supervel45 wrote:Did you check the thermostat?

Yes, I put a new one in when I replaced the intake and it was tested in boiling water on the stove prior to it going in.

Adding the second fan seemed to help some on the drive I just took. I might break down and order a new Aluminum Radiator with dual electric fans. and shroud, and upgrade to the heavy duty water pump since those are only $40 at the same time.

I have a new AC system to install but don't even want to install the condenser till I get this under controller.


FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  supervel45 on July 30th 2015, 9:23 pm

I would get the biggest radiator you can find. The Super Duty Modines that came in those trucks were giant 4 row jobs.

supervel45

Posts : 3070
Join date : 2013-09-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  maverick on July 30th 2015, 9:28 pm

And a good full shroud is a big deal. Wink
avatar
maverick
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 3051
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 66

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 10:15 pm

Would a Champion 4 row like this be a good solution?



$440ish free shipping.

I do notice this unit comes with a 16psi radiator cap, and the one that comes with the bronco is 13 psi, however the bronco came with a 351m/400 and not a 460.

At some point I still have to install an AC condenser in front of the radiator which will not help matters any.

FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  butterbean on July 30th 2015, 10:24 pm

test your radiator cap, something as simple as that will do what you are describing
avatar
butterbean

Posts : 676
Join date : 2012-12-25
Age : 54
Location : Naples, Florida

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  maverick on July 30th 2015, 10:33 pm

FSU_Bronco wrote:Would a Champion 4 row like this be a good solution?



$440ish free shipping.

I do notice this unit comes with a 16psi radiator cap, and the one that comes with the bronco is 13 psi, however the bronco came with a 351m/400 and not a 460.

At some point I still have to install an AC condenser in front of the radiator which will not help matters any.

Holy crap affraid Do you have room for that thing?? Behind the rear seat, maybe?
avatar
maverick
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 3051
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 66

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  jasonf on July 30th 2015, 11:12 pm

It seems strange that this pretty much happened after changing the intake and adding the efi. Any chance the efi is not working correct and it is too lean? Is the timing right after the intake change?
avatar
jasonf
BBF CONTRIBUTOR
BBF CONTRIBUTOR

Posts : 2773
Join date : 2009-07-14
Age : 48
Location : Lafayette, LA

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  supervel45 on July 30th 2015, 11:23 pm

I went out and measured my superduty Modine out of the 78 F150. 28"W 30"T with a 4" thick top tank. The one the OP pictured looks more like the standard Ford truck radiator for those years.

supervel45

Posts : 3070
Join date : 2013-09-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 30th 2015, 11:37 pm

butterbean wrote:test your radiator cap, something as simple as that will do what you are describing

New Radiator Cap

maverick wrote:

Holy crap affraid   Do you have room for that thing??  Behind the rear seat, maybe?

I think it will fit:


jasonf wrote:It seems strange that this pretty much happened after changing the intake and adding the efi. Any chance the efi is not working correct and it is too lean? Is the timing right after the intake change?

Idle 1200 rpm +/- in neutral, 800 in gear.
AFR 14.2 Idle
Cruise 14.0
WOT 12.8 (seldom do I run 12.Cool

Timing is pretty close, she starts easy and runs smooth.

supervel45 wrote:I went out and measured my superduty Modine out of the 78 F150. 28"W 30"T with a 4" thick top tank. The one the OP pictured looks more like the standard Ford truck radiator for those years.

I am almost positive the Bronco came from the factory is a 1 or 2 row radiator. I would be almost as positive that the one in it is factory and has had some repairs over the years.

The one in the picture claims to be 3 1/4 inch thick.




FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  SLord82 on July 30th 2015, 11:42 pm

FSU_Bronco wrote:I have a Ford 460 out of a 1970 lincoln in my 1979 bronco.

I know very little about history of the engine as I purchased the bronco on ebay and they engine was in the truck when I bought, the PO stated it had a 351m and didn't even know the engine had been swapped.

Only modifications to the engine:

Edelbrock Performer 460 Intake
MSD Atomic EFI
Electric FAN (removed mech fan as there was no shroud).
New plugs/wires and dizzy cap/rotor.
Changed the oil and flushed the coolant and replaced. New Thermostat and New Radiator cap.

Issue:
engine is showing signs of overheating at low temps. I will start getting boil over at around 195 out the radiator drain hose. It just recently started this. I have tried burping the system with no change. This is also the reason I installed the electric fan that made no difference.

Any thoughts or insight would be appreciated.

Thanks
Edwin










So you did all these mods at once and now it overheats?

My guess is that the electric fan you put on can't cool it.

If you cruise down the highway does it stay cool?

Have you tried putting the mech fan back on? Even without a shroud it'll still move a ton of air.

What electric fan did you put on? Most of the aftermarket fans are crap.

SLord82

Posts : 124
Join date : 2011-07-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  bbf-falcon on July 30th 2015, 11:56 pm

The Fan is pulling and NOT pushing.right? Also,if you can find a Fan from a Mark viii Lincoln,that will cool that baby down.

bbf-falcon

Posts : 8992
Join date : 2008-12-03
Location : Jackson, Ohio

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  supervel45 on July 30th 2015, 11:58 pm

Most of the factory radiators I have seen are 3 row in those years. You can look through the cap and count the rows, when the water level is low enough. If the radiator you pictured is listed for 73-79 P/U's it will fit the Bronco. I agree with the poster above, electric fans are not that great. It would be nice to put a timing light on it and make sure were you are at.

supervel45

Posts : 3070
Join date : 2013-09-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FalconEh on July 31st 2015, 12:01 am

What did you flush the rad with, if you reduced the flow of the rad with sediment it will get hot, head gaskets are in question especially with the exhaust described, have you done a compression test on all cylinders, did you scrape the old intake gaskets off, and did you plug the passages prior, is the replacement rad cap equal to or greater pressure than the one that was on it...
avatar
FalconEh

Posts : 1420
Join date : 2014-08-21
Location : on the blacktop or in the mountains ????

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  supervel45 on July 31st 2015, 12:03 am

bbf-falcon wrote:The Fan is pulling and NOT pushing.right? Also,if you can find a Fan from a Mark viii Lincoln,that will cool that baby down.
         You posted before I hit enter. The Lincoln Mark VIII is a different animal, compared to what he has now.

supervel45

Posts : 3070
Join date : 2013-09-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  FSU_Bronco on July 31st 2015, 12:19 am

SLord82 wrote:
So you did all these mods at once and now it overheats?
My guess is that the electric fan you put on can't cool it.
If you cruise down the highway does it stay cool?
Have you tried putting the mech fan back on? Even without a shroud it'll still move a ton of air.
What electric fan did you put on? Most of the aftermarket fans are crap.

No the mods were not all done at once.
MSD Atomic.
New Dual Exhaust installed (no cats)
Had a leak in the old factory intake due to a broken bolt that held the choke (sensor).
The electric fan was an attempt to fix the issue.
I installed a Hayden Rapid Cool electric fan. 1300 CFM.
(Today I installed a second fan on the outside on the passenger side as a pusher, this seemed to help a lot.) No idea of the brand it came with my ac system so I used it since I had it handy, it does seem much faster than the Hayden.

bbf-falcon wrote:The Fan is pulling and NOT pushing.right? Also,if you can find a Fan from a Mark viii Lincoln,that will cool that baby down.
Now I have one pulling and one offset pushing, both are being controlled by the MSD and kick on at 180.


supervel45 wrote:Most of the factory radiators I have seen are 3 row in those years. You can look through the cap and count the rows, when the water level is low enough. If the radiator you pictured is listed for 73-79 P/U's it will fit the Bronco. I agree with the poster above, electric fans are not that great. It would be nice to put a timing light on it and make sure were you are at.

I will do this.

FalconEh wrote:What did you flush the rad with, if you reduced the flow of the rad with sediment it will get hot, head gaskets are in question especially with the exhaust described, have you done a compression test on all cylinders, did you scrape the old intake gaskets off, and did you plug the passages prior, is the replacement rad cap equal to or greater pressure than the one that was on it...  

I removed the bottom hose and the cockpit on the bottom and ran the hose through it for an extended period, at first lots of rust colored sediment seemed to come out.

The new Radiator cap is the same as the one that was on it, 13psi.

Yes I removed all the old gasket, used a light wire wheel and completely cleaned the surface before installing the new gasket.

Used Fel-Pro gaskets and Gasgacinch Gasket Sealer, along with black rtv around the water openings and the ends of the intake. Allowed all to cure for 24 hours before cranking the engine.

I used shop rags cut in half in the passages and counted and pulled all out when I was done prepping and also vacuumed and then blew everything off.

I haven't tested compression on all the cylinders yet.



FSU_Bronco

Posts : 56
Join date : 2015-07-30

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Ford 460 overheating

Post  SLord82 on July 31st 2015, 12:21 am

supervel45 wrote:
bbf-falcon wrote:The Fan is pulling and NOT pushing.right? Also,if you can find a Fan from a Mark viii Lincoln,that will cool that baby down.
         You posted before I hit enter. The Lincoln Mark VIII is a different animal, compared to what he has now.

Notice I said aftermarket. There a bunch of good electric fans from the factory. Taurus. Mark. Contour. Windstar. Etc

SLord82

Posts : 124
Join date : 2011-07-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum