Comp Cams CL34-340-4

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Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  gcj on March 6th 2017, 3:04 pm

Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?

Numbers: 224° / 224° in / ex. Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA lift ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know. One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  dfree383 on March 6th 2017, 3:37 pm

Why not just get the right cam ground up for it?
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Yes, so...

Post  gcj on March 6th 2017, 3:53 pm

That is a valid idea .... but what might that be, considering what I have. (I have looked at the archives, but most of what is there is far too advanced, not intended for an antiquated set of parts such as what I am stuck with)

I was under the impression that Comp does not use a generic "one size fits all" approach to their cam profiling and that they actually had done more research than some other cam manufacturers and that some of their cams might actually be "right" for this engine .... This is what has been said about them, including on this forum over the years.


G.

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  69F100 on March 6th 2017, 4:12 pm

Get with Randy or Lem and get a custom cam made it will not cost much more than a off the shelf cam when I had Randy make mine it wasn't but about $35 more than a off the shelf grind


Good looking ride
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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  IDT-572 on March 6th 2017, 7:01 pm

The exhaust barely flows 50% of the intake on those heads, Even a cam that small I wouldn't use a single pattern cam.

Call Lem or Randy for a custom grind.

You will be happy ! ! !!!!
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SCJ cam

Post  gcj on March 6th 2017, 7:38 pm

Point taken. But, this last comment sort of also answers my initial question about symmetrical / asymmetrical cams regarding those motors.

There has been a lot of talk here on this forum over the years on porting the N-code heads as well as the CJs ... is there any way to improve the exhaust side without going into major operations or punching through the roof?

G.

CJ on the stand:


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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  rmcomprandy on March 7th 2017, 12:23 am

IDT-572 wrote:The exhaust barely flows 50% of the intake on those heads, Even a cam that small I wouldn't use a single pattern cam.

Call Lem or Randy for a custom grind.

You will be happy ! ! !!!!

That cam would need to be advance 8 degrees or so from split overlap to even have a chance to work well.

If he already has that Comp, then use it, it needs to be degreed with that much advance but, only if it is already gotten.

The CRANE 216/228 is a pretty good hydraulic street cam for the often driven type, high performance vehicle.

I don't think that intake manifold will fit with the "shaker" hood.

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  dfree383 on March 7th 2017, 9:52 am

gcj wrote:Point taken. But, this last comment sort of also answers my initial question about symmetrical / asymmetrical cams regarding those motors.

There has been a lot of talk here on this forum over the years on porting the N-code heads as well as the CJs ... is there any way to improve the exhaust side without going into major operations or punching through the roof?

G.

CJ on the stand:


Yes you can improve the exhaust flow some, but the factory location and shape where a compromise to fit the chassis's the engines came in.

The fix is to improve the port the best you can and use appropriate cam timing to make up the balance.
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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 7th 2017, 12:06 pm

gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark. I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board. Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  IDT-572 on March 7th 2017, 1:37 pm

Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.

Would you want him to stay at 110 separation?
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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 7th 2017, 1:39 pm

IDT-572 wrote:
Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.

Would you want him to stay at 110 separation?

Maybe. That stroke is not a lot of demand.

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  IDT-572 on March 7th 2017, 1:44 pm

It's about like a YZ 125 Yamaha lol

Actually about like a .360 + overbore 351 Cleveland with even bigger ports.
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A note of thanks

Post  gcj on March 7th 2017, 7:51 pm

Guys, as usual when stuff is brought up on this forum, the responses are often in a dimension unknown to regular buffs. I have read what Jon Kaase has said about the D0OE-R heads and the demoting compromise Ford made when the decision was made to install them in cars with McPherson suspension ... and then ... when the 1972´s finally came along, the game was already over. He has also pointed out some engineering faults in the original designs. Faults he has addressed with his latest versions, still within CJ dimensions externally.

I have several of these engines and I have built several of them, almost exclusively for street driving: CID´s from 429´s to 466 to 474.

It´s time to shift gears and look at other solutions. There are engines for sale here on this forum where these problems have been effectively solved. That is the good news.

My Spoiler lost its #s matching engine years ago. So I am free to do what I want. I will have more questions. Hope you bear with me! Looking at the picture, I am facing West. New York is about 3000 miles in that direction Smile One major constraint!





466SCJ in front, 474CJ in the back:


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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Lem Evans on March 7th 2017, 8:12 pm

Very Happy

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  BOSS 429 on March 8th 2017, 12:19 pm

Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.





If you lose .040 of lift on this cam it will then be smaller then a stock cam
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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 8th 2017, 12:23 pm

BOSS 429 wrote:
Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.





If you lose .040 of lift on this cam it will then be smaller then a stock cam

At the end of the day its all about trapping the most air and fuel for a control explosion. To many times we caught up in lift and duration numbers. Just had a customer loose 110HP with bigger cam. Put mine back in the engine and 110HP was back. .100 shorter on lift and 20 degree duration smaller and much different valve events. The smoking gun. New cam pumped 150# of cylinder pressure. My cam pumped 240# average.

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Oh, oh ... overlap

Post  gcj on March 8th 2017, 1:24 pm

Back in Disco times this phenomenon was called overlap. As you all well know and as you say Straubtech, as you open up the numbers, degrees, LSA and lift you need to raise CR, which brings problems all its own.

As I have said, I have this dimensionally std. SCJ engine out of a documented ´71 Drag Pack car, according to Marti. I would like to build a factory appearing stock engine with some larger than average numbers. SCJ pistons, rods, 4U, crank, D0OE rods and heads, D0VE 4-bolt main etc. You know the drill. I have all the parts for the engine except the cam.

Cyclone bay and hood will not allow me to use anything other than a CJ/SCJ intake, both of which I have. I have a Stealth 8021 that I already used, too tall for ram air unit. I remember someone here posting a manifold pecking order a few years back. Seems the original SCJ manifold was very good. The ten Stock class Ford sponsored Cyclones went into the 11´s with H&M blueprinted hyd. lifter CJ´s They held records in at least one of the stock classes for a while. Does anyone here have any knowledge on the subject?

I will contact Lem or Randy about this, but it seems clear I need a loose converter. Any advice on a reliable maker?

This 474 w. D0OE heads, etc. L2404 pistons broke down. Detonation, probably.


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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  rmcomprandy on March 8th 2017, 8:27 pm

gcj wrote:Back in Disco times this phenomenon was called overlap. As you all well know and as you say Straubtech, as you open up the numbers, degrees, LSA and lift you need to raise CR, which brings problems all its own.

As I have said, I have this dimensionally std. SCJ engine out of a documented ´71 Drag Pack car, according to Marti.  I would like to build a factory appearing stock engine with some larger than average numbers. SCJ pistons, rods, 4U, crank, D0OE rods and heads, D0VE 4-bolt main etc. You know the drill. I have all the parts for the engine except the cam.

Cyclone bay and hood will not allow me to use anything other than a CJ/SCJ intake, both of which I have. I have a Stealth 8021 that I already used, too tall for ram air unit. I remember someone here posting a manifold pecking order a few years back. Seems the original SCJ manifold was very good. The ten Stock class Ford sponsored Cyclones went into the 11´s with H&M blueprinted hyd. lifter CJ´s They held records in at least one of the stock classes for a while. Does anyone here have any knowledge on the subject?

I will contact Lem or Randy about this, but it seems clear I need a loose converter. Any advice on a reliable maker?

This 474 w. D0OE heads, etc. L2404 pistons broke down. Detonation, probably.


You could use an Edelbrock "Torquer II" intake manifold and intake port match #1, #3, #6 and #8.  Dyno testing showed that port matching the rest will lose twice as much torque on the bottom of what you will gain on the top.

That Edelbrock manifold is LOWER than the stock manifold carb pad so, a "phenolic anti-heat" spacer of whatever thickness can now be used.

EDIT: Port matching just those cylinders will gain torque and horsepower everywhere.


Last edited by rmcomprandy on March 8th 2017, 8:31 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  BOSS 429 on March 8th 2017, 8:29 pm

Straubtech wrote:
BOSS 429 wrote:
Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.





If you lose .040 of lift on this cam it will then be smaller then a stock cam

At the end of the day its all about trapping the most air and fuel for a control explosion.   To many times we caught up in lift and duration numbers.  Just had a customer loose 110HP with bigger cam.  Put mine back in the engine and 110HP was back.   .100 shorter on lift and 20 degree duration smaller and much different valve events.  The smoking gun.  New cam pumped 150# of cylinder pressure.  My cam pumped 240# average.






so a smaller then stock cam will make more power ? oh ok.
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How about those rods ?

Post  manofmerc on March 9th 2017, 6:08 am

You know if you are building this cj engine I would replace those 45+ year old rods with some H beams and stick a 460 crankshaft in there as well .These guys on here are good at cam shaft grinding .I would go with a solid flat tappet similar to the scj grind .I had a four bolt main block also .One of my factory cj rods broke at the starting line of my local track .My four bolt main block was scrap iron .You have a good plan for your engine get some help with camshaft selection .I had RM grind a cam for me.My comet picked up four mph and almost two tenths he knows his business .Doug

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 9th 2017, 10:54 am

BOSS 429 wrote:
Straubtech wrote:
BOSS 429 wrote:
Straubtech wrote:
gcj wrote:Hi all:

Has anyone here used this Comp Cam?  

Numbers:  224°  / 224° in / ex.    Lift ,540 / ,540 ... symmetrical, solid lifter. LSA 110°

Application: 429 SCJ w. L2366 pistons, D0OE-R heads etc. Lightly ported. Unilite ignition, headers. C-6 trans. 3.73 rear end. Intake std. CJ w. 7040288 Q-Jet carb or SCJ int. w. 800 Holley

Car: Cyclone

I have a Crane 354551 hyd. 226° / 230° 112°LSA  lift  ,522 / .530 that I might use, depending on advice from those in the know.  One of the constraints is the ram air system. It limits the height of the intake, spacers and so on.

I also have a Crane 353941 hyd. w. 216°/ 228° @.050 lift of .513 / .518

I like the profile of the bigger, solid cam, but I have read many reports based on tests that the 385 like asymmetrical cams. Any comments on that issue?

G.




Add about 20 degrees of duration to the exhaust and loose about .040" of lift and then you would be in the ballpark.    I did hyd flat tappet cam swap with a fellow on this board.  Shelf stock to custom was well worth the money.





If you lose .040 of lift on this cam it will then be smaller then a stock cam

At the end of the day its all about trapping the most air and fuel for a control explosion.   To many times we caught up in lift and duration numbers.  Just had a customer loose 110HP with bigger cam.  Put mine back in the engine and 110HP was back.   .100 shorter on lift and 20 degree duration smaller and much different valve events.  The smoking gun.  New cam pumped 150# of cylinder pressure.  My cam pumped 240# average.






so a smaller then stock cam will make more power ?  oh ok.

PUt my Powerstroke cam in your diesel and then get back to me.

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Powerstroke 466SCJ !!

Post  gcj on March 9th 2017, 4:09 pm

Straubtech: Here it is.... the best truck ever made.




Back on topic:

The engine I have IN the car is a ´70 SCJ: 2YABC crank, D0OE rods, Wiseco flat tops 30 over, Crane custom ground steel roller, coated springs, titanium 10° retainers etc. etc.



What I was disappointed with in this setup was not the engine, but the VERY expensive MSD ignition system: Billet 8477 and Digital Six plus. I have changed bushings and springs in the distributor to no avail. Advance is still limited to about 19° centrifugal w. a maximum 10° initial setting. The digital box quits, indicator light falls out of sink with the ignition pulses, then dies. Worst money I ever spent. I get virtually no useful help from these people.

Anyone care to swap MSD complaints?

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Curt on March 9th 2017, 4:17 pm

I've had zero complaints with a plethora of MSD7 stuff for over 20 years.
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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 10th 2017, 12:56 pm

Curt wrote:I've had zero complaints with a plethora of MSD7 stuff for over 20 years.

Was that before it said "Made in China" on the box? I just got an order for 50 SB Ford distributor gears. This customer puts Morel gear on all there crate engine builds with new MSD distributors. They buy roughly 500 gears a year.

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Re: Comp Cams CL34-340-4

Post  Straubtech on March 10th 2017, 12:56 pm

gcj wrote:Straubtech: Here it is.... the best truck ever made.




Back on topic:

The engine I have IN the car is a ´70 SCJ:  2YABC crank, D0OE rods, Wiseco flat tops 30 over, Crane custom ground steel roller, coated springs, titanium 10° retainers etc. etc.  



What I was disappointed with in this setup was not the engine, but the VERY expensive MSD ignition system: Billet 8477 and Digital Six plus. I have changed bushings and springs in the distributor to no avail. Advance is still limited to about 19° centrifugal w. a maximum 10° initial setting. The digital box quits, indicator light falls out of sink with the ignition pulses, then dies. Worst money I ever spent. I get virtually no useful help from these people.

Anyone care to swap MSD complaints?

I don't even want to know what the freight bill was on that!!!!!!!!!!

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