Trying to find out about a piston

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Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 8th 2018, 8:02 pm

Well, today was the first day to pull the pan on the 572(supposedly) that I traded for. I cannot find out who made the piston only found a number 262617 on them. Haven't gotten to check bore yet, but supposedly a 4.5 bore. Can anyone find any information on that piston number? Thanks!

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  gt350hr on January 9th 2018, 11:57 am

Try Diamond. Sounds like their number.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  jbozzelle on January 9th 2018, 1:24 pm

That's not a Diamond number.

Put a tape across the bore and measure from the deck to the piston top at BDC. Easy to figure out CID from there...

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 9th 2018, 3:04 pm

I am going to try and get the bore sometime this week, I guess this is the problems that idiots like me run into when trading for things and not really having much of a chance to checkout what it is. this is supposed to be a 572 and he said like Arias pistons which they aren't unless he had them custom made(4.5 bore) and ford motorsports crank 4.5 stroke with alum rods. Rods are aluminum but so far cannot find info off the crank that I can get made out. Doesnt even have a pickup and has a regular melling HD pump. Heads were supposed to be TFS early Aheads but are actually FMS Aheads(i know not a ton of difference) but considering there is so much stuff i was told that isnt true(carb being a pro systems 1150, sent pics to Patrick and it's just an OLD L8896 1050 carb with his PS bowls thrown on it), I am going to have a lot more money in this thing then I was hoping for. Lesson learned I guess but i guess being ready for the start of season isnt going to be happening, next time I will know better.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  gt350hr on January 9th 2018, 5:51 pm

Unless it has been machined out , the only company that doesn't put their logo on the inside is Wiseco.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  rmcomprandy on January 9th 2018, 8:00 pm

cobrakid8 wrote:I am going to try and get the bore sometime this week, I guess this is the problems that idiots like me run into when trading for things and not really having much of a chance to checkout what it is. this is supposed to be a 572 and he said like Arias pistons which they aren't unless he had them custom made(4.5 bore) and ford motorsports crank 4.5 stroke with alum rods.

Most pistons in "custom" built engines are "custom made" pistons to the engine builder's specifications; no matter what brand piston company they use
You are possibly looking at a job number ... not a piston part number.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 9th 2018, 8:04 pm

rmcomprandy wrote:
cobrakid8 wrote:I am going to try and get the bore sometime this week, I guess this is the problems that idiots like me run into when trading for things and not really having much of a chance to checkout what it is. this is supposed to be a 572 and he said like Arias pistons which they aren't unless he had them custom made(4.5 bore) and ford motorsports crank 4.5 stroke with alum rods.

Most pistons in "custom" built engines are "custom made" pistons to the engine builder's specifications; no matter what brand piston company they use
You are possibly looking at a job number ... not a piston part number.

Thanks Randy, I did send the number to diamond and it isn't one of theirs either as a part number or job number, hopefully I can get back over to the engine soon enough and see if there's is anything else I can find on it

Also I went over and just took a look since the motor isn’t at my house and it has Howard alum rods, I will just pull the head and check bore as it was a little harder from below. The crank had STND stamped on it and I hope that doesn’t mean it’s a stock stroke crank, guess I will try and check that also.






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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  BBFTorino on January 10th 2018, 2:05 am

That looks like a stock crank to me!! Its not a steel forged unit either, looks like stock cast nodular iron.
Also, on the underside of the pistons is a number cast into them, looks like "449" from what I can see.....maybe see if you can cross reference that number with a manufacturer.
At this point, it would be wise for you to pull the whole thing apart and inspect everything.

Also, it looks like a D1VE factory block. I doubt that you'll find it has a 4.5" bore, as most will not go that big (there may be some that can, but the vast majority will not go that big without getting paper thin on the cylinder walls).
My first thoughts are that its a .030" (466), .040" (468), or a .060" (472) with aluminum rods and FMS heads.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  pmrphil on January 10th 2018, 9:40 am

I don't know, look how far the piston is pulled out of the bore, and how close the pin is to the bottom, never seen a stock stroke setup like that.
Maybe an offset grind?

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 10th 2018, 9:51 am

pmrphil wrote:I don't know, look how far the piston is pulled out of the bore, and how close the pin is to the bottom, never seen a stock stroke setup like that.
Maybe an offset grind?

That's what I thought also, they sure are pulled far out of The hole to be a stock stroke as well as some clearancing being done to block for the rods, does anyone know if Ford ever made a cast 4.50 crank? Hoping to pull the head here in the next few days and check the bore and maybe get the stroke also at that time. Really hope I didn't get completely bent over.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  pmrphil on January 10th 2018, 9:56 am

Easy enough to measure stroke from the bottom - just check how far up and down the bottom of the piston travels. Then grab your verniers and measure the skirt, it'll give you a rough idea of bore size.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  gt350hr on January 10th 2018, 12:59 pm

The shape of the pin bosses do look like an Arias part same for the stamping. Look on the opposite side of the three numbers forged onto the bottom of the piston for a logo.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 10th 2018, 1:40 pm

gt350hr wrote:   The shape of the pin bosses do look like an Arias part same for the stamping. Look on the opposite side of the three numbers forged onto the bottom of the piston for a logo.

Thanks, the guy I got it to actually said Alero pistons and I couldn’t find anything on that, I figured closest was Arias to Alero lol. Talked to them and it is their piston and they are going to try and find information on the order 262617, let’s just hope it wasn’t so old they can’t find the information. Thanks everyone

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  stanger68 on January 10th 2018, 2:07 pm

Easy way to measure without pulling the heads would be to just use something like a straw or a stick. Stuck in there and mark it with a sharpie the pull it out and trim it until it's snug fit, measure with a caliper or a tape. Long handled needle nose would help greatly. It's definitely not a stock stroke from looking at the pin heights. Crank doesn't look forged either though.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  Paul Kane on January 10th 2018, 3:02 pm

D1 block, 2Y crank. Howards rods, Arias pistons, smallish roller cam, roller chain, all aftermarket parts appear era-similar, probably actually a 472 aka "foggy memory 572" except....

...except that the "mains 010 rods std" would be more indicative of the OEM crankshaft having been stroked.  Take a closer look for more stampings near the rods mains sizing because there might be a stoke value stamped there as well.  If not, then pull a rod cap to get journal size or bearing part number.
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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 10th 2018, 7:03 pm

Paul Kane wrote:D1 block, 2Y crank. Howards rods, Arias pistons, smallish roller cam, roller chain, all aftermarket parts appear era-similar, probably actually a 472 aka "foggy memory 572" except....

...except that the "mains 010 rods std" would be more indicative of the OEM crankshaft having been stroked.  Take a closer look for more stampings near the rods mains sizing because there might be a stoke value stamped there as well.  If not, then pull a rod cap to get journal size or bearing part number.

Hopefully I can get piston info soon enough, but the bore is 4.5 or pretty dang close when I measured it. Also the stroke is close to if not a little more than 4.40 it seems as I measured piston down the bore and it was 4 and back up .40 of the piston came out. These are really crude but I do now believe the bore is 4.5 which I hope it has enough meat there to be ok, paul I didn’t find any other markings on the crank though. I just hope it will run 5.10’s or 20’s so that I can slow it down for Tyler to run 5.70 with it locally.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  Paul Kane on January 10th 2018, 7:42 pm

If it has that much stroke then the crankshaft is aftermarket.  I did see some machining features and witness marks on a counterweight that gave me pause about OEM but figured those features were probably associated with the application of aluminum rods.  But now that you've researched bore and stroke obviously it might be a big bore and stroke afterall.
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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 10th 2018, 7:55 pm

Paul Kane wrote:If it has that much stroke then the crankshaft is aftermarket.  I did see some machining features and witness marks on a counterweight that gave me pause about OEM but figured those features were probably associated with the application of aluminum rods.  But now that you've researched bore and stroke obviously it might be a big bore and stroke afterall.

Does anyone have any pics of the FMS 4.3 crank, as I would like to see if it compares to this one and maybe it was offset to 4.5 from there? For now though I am to the point of just getting the last bits of parts I need and get it running. This motor will not be turned all that high and I hope it I can do that I can make it live till next season and maybe at that point get an aftermarket block and build whatever I want. At this point it’s a budget build that I would like to have it run as fast as the 477 Chevy that came off the pipe rack that ran 5.0’s, guess we shall see.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  torino501 on January 10th 2018, 10:04 pm

the inside of that engine looks horrible.... silicone on the oil pump to block... that poor engine has been neglected. bad...

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  torino501 on January 10th 2018, 10:06 pm

cam is stained from old oil being in it so long...

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 10th 2018, 10:46 pm

torino501 wrote:cam is stained from old oil being in it so long...

I am pretty sure it was prob put together 5 years or more ago and sat in someone’s garage put together just sitting there, never being turned over or anything. Guy now of course won’t answer me back and I have no one to blame but myself. I should have just sold the junk(Chevy) and bought me a motor after that. Live and learn from my mistake is all I can do. I am sure I am off on my measurements but I would hazard a guess it’s at least a 4.40 bore and 4.30 stroke. Heads do look in good shape as does the FMS intake, but it isn’t even close to what I was told it was; from the crappy carb, no oil pickup at all, the non forged crank, the new meziere water pump(has no name on it at all so prob an eBay special) and the heads being TFS instead of FMS. The only thing I was told that was right about it all is the new Ultrabell lol.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  stanger68 on January 11th 2018, 6:12 am

There is still hope. I have a lunati forged 4.5" crank I know is legit since I bought direct from them and it has no marking on it what so ever. Pictures can be very deceiving.

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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 20th 2018, 8:31 pm

Alright guys, I couldn’t get the motor turned over by myself earlier as it kept wanting to spin on my old engine stand. But it does seem Paul you were correct, it a stock crank I would guess as it seems tonight best I could measure it was 4.14 so a offset ground crank it seems, can a stock crank be offset to be a little more than 4.14? Also the bore is 4.50 as I was able to measure that tonight, so with the block half filled I hope it can last a while. So what would a 4.14x4.50 equal in CID? Also I am sure I was lied to on the valves being titanium also Sad. I was ripped off pretty well I this deal.





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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  cobrakid8 on January 20th 2018, 8:34 pm




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Re: Trying to find out about a piston

Post  jbozzelle on January 20th 2018, 8:43 pm

If that bore is right you have a 526. Sure it's not a 4.44 bore? If so, that'd be a 512. Cubic inch calculator link below...

http://www.wallaceracing.com/cid.php


How much money did you give for that engine? What heads?

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