Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on January 31st 2018, 4:24 pm

I put that edge seal on just this weekend as using my airflow fleabay meter i could measure is sucking from the gap on the fan side, i was able to measure a difference from the front side pulling but will see once i take it out for a drive.

Also sent off an email to Rad manufacturer to ask about shround / possibility or doing half on one side or some radical offset style to see if can miss that waterpump pulley etc.
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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  jasonf on January 31st 2018, 7:11 pm

bigblockfordfxstb wrote:I put that edge seal on just this weekend as using my airflow fleabay meter i could measure is sucking from the gap on the fan side, i was able to measure a difference from the front side pulling but will see once i take it out for a drive.

Also sent off an email to Rad manufacturer to ask about shround /  possibility or doing half on one side or some radical offset style to see if can miss that waterpump pulley etc.

Where do you live at?
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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  stanger68 on February 1st 2018, 12:09 am

You don't need to call the manufacturer for a shroud. All you need to do is cut a piece of 16 ga. aluminum the size of the radiator core then cut two round holes in it the size of the fans, drill mounting holes and wa la. you have a shroud. You wont loose any clearance to speak of. Judging from the pic you shouldn't need a lip, just flat metal.

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 6th 2018, 9:23 am

Afternoon all,

Stanger68, the issue around just putting on a shroud is the clearance between the waterpump shaft & pulley and the fans.

I need to think about how I would mount the shroud, and if I can offset the fans anymore as you can see from the photo I dont have clearance on the right fan is very tight...

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 6th 2018, 9:39 am

I may post another topic question, but with the various info in my initial post with my engine build, what should my base timing be 12deg BTDC ? or expected to be ? And also the advance rpm levels at 2000, 3000 etc.

At present RPM
850 16-17deg
1500 24deg
2600 36deg
3000 38-39deg






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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  stanger68 on February 6th 2018, 8:53 pm

16 ga.is less than a 1/16 of an inch thick. 14 ga. is about an even 1/16 that's only 1 or 2 rounds of threads on that mounting stud that is holding the fan in your pic.

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 6th 2018, 9:23 pm

Hi Stanger.
If i made a shroud and the fan sits ontop, its going to hit the waterpump ? (It looks to be around 1/4 inch) If the shroud is only say 7/16 from the actual surface of the core will it even work , and or not totaly block it for higher speed ?





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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  stanger68 on February 7th 2018, 12:55 am

At higher speeds it will act like an air dam and cool even more. What is happening now is the hot air is circling around the fan. Air, water, oil, electricity, etc. will always take the path of least resistance, without a shroud it is easier for the fan to pull from the gap than through the flue's of the radiator. Some engines will work without a shroud in certain body styles but when they are crammed in a tight space like your car, you're going to have to work for it.

The only reason I said aluminum is its lighter and will match the radiator better aesthetically. You could use thinner steel sheet metal which is more rigid if it helps with clearance. Or if you have access to a bead roller add some beads for reinforcement. As short as the span is it shouldn't need much if any reinforcement. I would stop by your local metal supply they probably have scraps they will give to make something that small.

Think of it this way... in the current form the fan is trying to draw water through a straw without it's lips on the straw. I'm sure the weatherstripping will do some good, it may even be enough depending on the climate but you're only effectively using half the radiator.

As for the timing I'd say you're in the right ball park 12-16. Run as much as you can and it still crank easily when it's hot. which is normally around 14-15 deg initial.

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 7th 2018, 2:26 am

Yer nice one thanks for help.

I thought the weather strip made a difference as testing the air flow around the fans with a air flow meter thingi, the fans where sucking from the gaps around the fan shrouds. But it was short lived once at traffic lights.

Got a few other small things also to test next...

1. Strip out inners of thermostat to see if could be flow restriction problem.
2. Once hot say 210f . Pull over and keep revs at 2000rpm. I noticed in one of my small temp logs when i did this for about 5 seconds It dropped a few degf. Possible pulley ratio issue ? CVF pulleys and supplier waterpump say it should be bulletproof. I belive its a 1:1 ratio ( will double check tonight the WP pulley is not slightly smaller) and the WP itself is supposed to flow 20% more even at low RPM as questioned it was not some racing 5000rpm unit etc....

The rad supplier saying it possible that it may well be a capacity issue and require more, slightly wider and thicker  core. But consern is wider core is less space again so would like test the shroud idea also before going to that step.

I may be also about to lower the bottom rad support slightly and move the rad forward 3/8' give me slighly more room without cutting the front rad support that is structural....

Will post some more pics....

Shoukd have listened to my dad years ago... dont touch the car...
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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  jasonf on February 7th 2018, 9:55 am

I think you are missing the point of what we are saying about the shroud. Looking at your pictures the fan mounting tabs on the radiator are already spaced off the core. Just take some 16 ga alum the size of the hole radiator and rivet/screw it to the fan tabs (Of course you have to cut two holes for the fans first). Lose the fan seals because you won't need them now. This will space your fans back 1/16" which you have room for. It will also force the fans to suck all their air through the entire radiator core.
Jason

bigblockfordfxstb wrote:Hi,





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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 7th 2018, 10:09 am

Hi Jasonf,

I hear you, but that small amount of gap would be fine yes ?! just when I see all the other shrouds , they normally have some space...I also might be able to squeeze an extra 3/8 with pushing the rad in under the rad cross member giving more space !

Thank again
R
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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  jbozzelle on February 7th 2018, 11:47 am

All you can do is try. A small space between the core and shroud is better than no space. If you can push the radiator forward at all that will help.

Plus if you could shift that one fan off to the side any more and get it away from the pulley that would help you to make the shroud deeper. That fan doesn't need to sit directly over the core. If you have a shroud that would direct the air to it you could let the fan hang off the side of the tank and let the shroud direct air to it...

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  jasonf on February 7th 2018, 1:27 pm

bigblockfordfxstb wrote:Hi Jasonf,

I hear you, but that small amount of gap would be fine yes ?! just when I see all the other shrouds , they normally have some space...I also might be  able to squeeze an extra 3/8 with pushing the rad in under the rad cross member giving more space !

Thank again
R

I built a shroud for my tbucket and it was less then 1/2" so I would try it.

This is what I mean.

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Re: Running 2 hot seeking advice - Timing ?

Post  bigblockfordfxstb on February 7th 2018, 3:31 pm

Great information. Ill get to working on this, will be little time before can get to it thou!



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