Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

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Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on February 11th 2018, 1:16 am

Like the topic says, can eliminator caps be used on a dove block?
I can’t find the pro comp caps which are easier to machine.
I can’t tell if the eBay caps are cat caps or not.
The program caps are the same price As the eliminator caps but you only get the three middle caps.
And I have not found a source for the a460 caps.
I understand the milidon caps ar also hard, so it looks like the choices are pro gram or maybe eliminator

Any ideas?

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  dfree383 on February 11th 2018, 9:41 am

Program or Milodon are your best options

I've never heard of the milodon ones being hard to machine, it is the "CAT" or Chinese ones with that reputation
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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  pmrphil on February 11th 2018, 12:41 pm

I've never found a need to replace the front and rear caps, 2 & 4 are the ones that show the most improvement when replaced, I personally prefer the Pro-Gram caps, even though sometimes Kenny has a delay in production, I like them the best.

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Wayne Pearce on February 11th 2018, 12:46 pm

My machinist complained that the Milodon caps were the toughest cast iron he'd ever seen. He resorted to cutting a lot of the excess material off the caps in a shaper. On a side note, the bolts provided by Milodon for the outer holes are pure garbage - do yourself a favor and by quality hardware to replace them.

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i may have missunderstood about the milodon caps

Post  ChrisH on February 11th 2018, 10:37 pm

http://www.429-460.com/t12345-4-bolt-caps

the link above is where I was getting my information. but I believe I miss read a little about the milodon caps.

I just happened to be searching for caps and came across the eliminator blocks and noticed you could buy their caps. I was wondering if they were usable in any other platform but their blocks.

so at this point it looks to be down to pro gram or milodon.



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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  stanger68 on February 11th 2018, 11:54 pm

I used pro gram with mine mainly because my machinist didn't want to use anything else. But during my shopping I did find a guy named Ted with a company called Engine Systems in Georgia sells a dowelled Flat bottom style he says will work with any block. And they are pretty reasonably priced also.

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Paul Kane on February 12th 2018, 4:46 pm

ChrisH wrote:Like the topic says, can eliminator caps be used on a dove block?
I can’t find the pro comp caps which are easier to machine.
I can’t tell if the eBay caps are cat caps or not.
The program caps are the same price As the eliminator caps but you only get the three middle caps.
And I have not found a source for the a460 caps.
I understand the milidon caps ar also hard, so it looks like the choices are pro gram or maybe eliminator

Any ideas?
I've never done it and can only speculate, but I would think the Eliminator caps could be fitted to a 2-bolt D0VE block.  The bigger question is why you feel you need all five main caps.  The additional effort and cost of the align hone for caps 1 & 5 will not net you any substantial hp supporting capability of the D0VE block, most certainly not from the stand point of gain vs cost.  OEM SCJ blocks have supported more than 1000 hp and billet capped blocks (on 2, 3, & 4) have supported 1700-1800 hp for several people I know.  Do you need all 5? Perhaps you would be better off buying just the center 3 caps.

Then again, for $100 and considering the gain vs cost ratio, I'll take the Procomp billet steel caps over any other cap on the planet when it comes to 4-bolting a passenger car block.  This mod, with those caps, will be the strongest part of the block, meaning that the cast iron block will fail long before the billet steel caps do (actually, in reality the steel caps won't fail).

I do see Milodon caps on eBay for $300.  I don't see any other caps, but if you provide a link I'll take a look so see if they're Procomps or not.  By the way, the CAT caps might be inconvenient when it comes to installing them, but if you approach the installation with the knowledge and patience, the results are the same and the CAT caps are just fine.
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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on February 12th 2018, 11:50 pm

i wasn't overly concern about 1 and 5. the cost was roughly the same as the pro gram caps so I wondered if it was possible.
based on the link i posted i would choose the procomp caps if i can come across them.
i am leary of using the hardened parts due to the effort and attention it requires to get them right.

https://www.southwestspeed.com/?sec=view_part&id=26903

this link is one i found. the photo is a stock image and the same for all the caps.
however it does say it is a splayed 1025 steel like the procomps are advertised.
it also states the part number is PCE 4211. i have to imagine this stands for procomp electronics which seems to be the full company name.

of course i could be completely wrong about all of this.

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Paul Kane on February 13th 2018, 1:06 am

That's definitely a generic picture of a cast cap.  I would probably call them and ask/confirm whether they will be shipping you a set of Procomp caps or not.

Here are the Procomp caps on eBay, not currently for sale, different part number but that might be a typo on the part of the seller:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-429-460-OEM-2-Bolt-to-4-Bolt-Splayed-Billet-Steel-Main-Caps-Middle-3-Caps-/302210808640

You can message the eBay seller and ask if they have any more.

I do have a set of used Procomp caps over here but I want $100 for them (more than the cost of a new set).  Mine have the convenience of already being opened up to ~3.193" main bearing bore and also includes some fastener hardware.   The catch, though, is how closely the main bore in the caps align with the next block they go on...every block is slightly different.  An align bore will still be necessary on the next block to which they are eventually fitted but not so much material removal as with a set of new caps
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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on February 13th 2018, 11:49 pm

Paul,
if you are willing to sell them then I will by them for the $100 plus shipping as listed. The extra knowledge about the various caps you have provided is worth the few extra dollars. not to mention they are already prepped.

I will likely order a set from the other website as well after I speak with them to confirm that they are indeed what I believe them to be.
It won't hurt to have a spare set on the shelf for a later date. especially since they are not always available.

if you would rather not sell this set, no problem I will order from the other website or find another path forward.

however, if you are willing to sell let me know how you would like payment.

thank you
chris

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Paul Kane on February 14th 2018, 2:05 am

ChrisH wrote:Paul,
if you are willing to sell them then I will by them for the $100 plus shipping as listed. The extra knowledge about the various caps you have provided is worth the few extra dollars. not to mention they are already prepped.

I will likely order a set from the other website as well after I speak with them to confirm that they are indeed

thank you
chris
Hi Chris, just to re-emphasize: the likelihood of these bored caps fitting the very next block is about as equal as pulling a set of OEM caps from one passenger car block and then fitting them to another block.  It can be done but will probably take checking the caps against a few blocks until you find a good candidate for the donor caps (ie, close enough match to just align-hone).  I've been successful doing it.

In your case if you strike out with your intended block then at least you'll have the brand new caps as a "Plan B."  And then these caps would still be in search of a block which accommodates decent fitment.  If you want them, check your Private Messages for payment options. If not, then I'll probably fit them to a block over here.

Thanks for the kind words...
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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Mike R on February 15th 2018, 12:59 am

Chris, I emailed the EBAY seller and they expect a new shipment in the next 60 days

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on February 15th 2018, 1:32 pm

Paul,
I sent the requested money as you requested.
the details are in a PM I sent to you along with my address and phone number

Mike,
thank you for asking about the other caps. I will keep that as an option depending on how Paul Kanes caps fit up to my current block

thanks
chris

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Paul Kane on February 15th 2018, 2:01 pm

ChrisH wrote:Paul,
I sent the requested money as you requested.
the details are in a PM I sent to you along with my address and phone number
thanks
chris
Sounds good, thanks.


Mike R wrote:...I emailed the EBAY seller and they expect a new shipment in the next 60 days
Oh man Laughing I gotta tell ya that is the exact, standard-issue procomop reply when asking about an out-of-stock item.  I've heard it twenty-plus times and you (they) never know when an item will really hit our shores again. Anything is possible and it might really be just 60 days....not that it has before.

When the caps are available again I suggest we all buy two sets.  Laughing
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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  BBFTorino on February 16th 2018, 12:22 am

Would'nt making a set out of wood be stronger than ProComp stuff??.......just joking!! Very Happy

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Mike R on March 12th 2018, 9:26 pm

Chris, did you ever find a source for new main caps?

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on March 13th 2018, 9:15 pm

no, I have had several items come up (I had to rebuild the back of my 7.3 superduty . . . rust problems). I got the block and caps from paul to the machine shop, but I have not ordered the other ones.
actually I will go ahead and order them tonight so I don't forget again.

i'll post when they arrive.

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Mike R on March 13th 2018, 9:22 pm

Did they confirm they were the right caps?

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on March 13th 2018, 9:30 pm

I never got the chance to call.
but they have a PCE part number which is procomp.
I just ordered a set and I will see what arrives. worst case I would be out $35 for shipping and restock if they are unusable. But since these are the only caps available right now that look to fit the description i'll take the risk.

I believe these are the right part, but we will see in a couple days.

chris

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  ChrisH on March 14th 2018, 5:27 pm

they are out of stock here as well. they refunded me today

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Re: Can eliminator main caps be used on a dove block

Post  Mike R on March 14th 2018, 9:06 pm

I bought a set of Milodon's

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