More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

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More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  2L8ULOST on Wed 20 Oct 2010 - 20:52

Im really wanting to get into the high 500 to low 600 range on torque, was wondering if this would be better just building a 460 stock stroke and rod length with good h/c/i or building a stroker like 514 or 521 with iron DOVE heads with a good cam and intake jw im kinda new to this BBF thing THANKS IN ADVANCE! IM wanting a car i can drive to the track and possibly to shows when racing seasons off!


Last edited by 2L8ULOST on Wed 20 Oct 2010 - 20:52; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Spelling)

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  richter69 on Wed 20 Oct 2010 - 22:07

stroke it IMO..........

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  72mav on Wed 20 Oct 2010 - 22:08

Welcome.
And go to the proven builds section, or the top here on engine tech. Dave Ohagens build up stickeys listed will get you there.
A 472 .080 overbore X 3.85 stroke and DOVE heads should get you there economically.
Goodluck.
Al

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Maddmattmustangs on Thu 21 Oct 2010 - 1:55

I'd do the stroker, no replacement for displacement

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  bigblok2000ranger on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 12:20

Stroker all the way! Put a good bottom end in it that way when you want more power (and you will) you won't be worried weather the bottom end will hold it.

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 14:37

I'd do the heads, 500-600ft Lbs is doable with stock 460 dimensions, but to make power you need to move air. Plus you'll lose some weight with something like Ford Racing SCJ's or P-51's.

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  RAGTOPJAMES on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 19:11

Who sells the SCJ heads and P-51's ? I've seen the SCJ's in Summitt but not the others .

Thanks

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  '65 T-BOLT on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 19:15

Lem Evans!

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Lem Evans on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 19:26

$784.95 each. heads are assemblied.


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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Big block fox 339 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 19:53

stroke it FTW!!!

I would stroke it because when you want more power which will b about a week all you gotta do is bolt on some tfs streets heads

with stock bottom end and good heads your maxed out

my dove headed 545 small cam makes what your lookin for for around 3000-3500 bucks then throw on the street heads bam lot more power

If I had to do it again I would go with a forged 4.3 crank at around 9.5 to 1 and 4 bolt main so I could turbo it later

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 20:16

If you think you need more than 460" to blow the tires off most street rides you need help.

650-700hp is pretty doable without stroking it on pump gas.

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  schmitty on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 20:43

Dave is pointing you in a good direction here IMHO. You can get a real respectable hp with good heads vs. the tq the stroker makes, and use the better hp with proper gears to multiply the torque the engine makes. It's all about the total package. In a lightweight car, you don't want to make too much tq and have nasty street manners. Cool

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Bernie on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 21:04

schmitty wrote: In a lightweight car, you don't want to make too much tq and have nasty street manners. Cool

Speak for yourself...


Last edited by Bernie on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 21:05; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : brevity)

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 21:16

Bernie wrote:
schmitty wrote: In a lightweight car, you don't want to make too much tq and have nasty street manners. Cool

Speak for yourself...

how much faster you going to spin the tires on street pavement, with a 514 than a 460..... Laughing

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  racerk_2000 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 22:51

I looked at the same thing that you are trying to do.
I went with a set of P-51 heads with a .030 over 460. Now my application is different. I am going be strictly bracket racing.
read this article/add at jon Kaase's web sight.
http://www.jonkaaseracingengines.com/component/content/article/40-kaase-products/188-kaase-p-51-cylinder-heads.html
If you look at the numbers on the cam, it is not that big. 255/262 at 0.50 lift, it is a roller with a lot of lift but I think that similar HP numbers could be made with a big solid.
Also, I got my heads from Lem Evans. He sells both the P-51's and the SCJ's and he is a super guy. When I did mine, he didn't have the super deal on the SCJ's like he does now. I don't know what your budget is but a call to Lem would not be a bad idea. The guy has tons of knowledge.
just my 2 cents.

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Bernie on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 23:11

dfree383 wrote:
Bernie wrote:
schmitty wrote: In a lightweight car, you don't want to make too much tq and have nasty street manners. Cool

Speak for yourself...

how much faster you going to spin the tires on street pavement, with a 514 than a 460..... Laughing

Not as fast as you can spin them with a 598.


Oh come on, this is the only place I can be a kid Embarassed ... Just because you have it, doesn't mean you have to use it all at once.

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 23:15

Laughing Laughing Thats true......

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  schmitty on Tue 26 Oct 2010 - 23:29

Very true that you don't have to use it, but sometimes the difference between using it and not is a very small window on the throttle, and that could mean the difference between making to the track in one piece and making it to the hospital in several. Cool

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Wed 27 Oct 2010 - 0:01

With all the big hp numbers And big inches thrown around in magazines and on the Internet it amazing how desencitized we've become to how much is enough.

Example is Freiuburger over at hot rod throwing me under the bus over only building a 432" boss 429 rather than building say a 557.... Same cost and a bunch more power right?

But what they all fail to tell everyone is the cost of everything else that goes with the manly hp numbers.... Trans, rear, cooling, bla bla bla (read$$$$)

That motor made 700 hp at 10.5:1 with a flat tappet cam and a single 1050..... And I will tell you it would have absolutly punished any street tire made..... So how much is enough?

Ask Jon Kaase about his Boss powered Street Mustang.... He'll let you know...

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  TorinoGT on Wed 27 Oct 2010 - 11:18

dfree383 wrote: So how much is enough?

...more horsepower than your friend has, *thats* enough! Smile

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  bigblok2000ranger on Sat 30 Oct 2010 - 1:25

460= 600hp@~7000rpm's or 521=600hp@55-6000rpm's which one is gonna live longer? I think the stroker will live longer because of the lower rpm's to achieve the same power as the short stroke deal. The engine will be happier at lower rpms with a mild stroker. JMO so flame away!

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  DJOHAGIN on Sat 30 Oct 2010 - 2:00

bigblok2000ranger wrote:460= 600hp@~7000rpm's or 521=600hp@55-6000rpm's which one is gonna live longer? I think the stroker will live longer because of the lower rpm's to achieve the same power as the short stroke deal. The engine will be happier at lower rpms with a mild stroker. JMO so flame away!

IMHO, they are both going to last the same. For a true "street" engine, the engine spends most of its time below 4000 rpm with short bursts to either 6 or 7 grand, so it's not like you're doing 6 or 7k sustained. If you want to get more technical, the piston speed of a 4.3 stroke at 6000 rpm is 4300 FPM, and a 460 at 7000 rpm is 4492 FPM, again, not much of a difference.

Again, IMHO. Smile

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  nuclearcobra on Sat 30 Oct 2010 - 8:39

72mav wrote:Welcome.
And go to the proven builds section, or the top here on engine tech. Dave Ohagens build up stickeys listed will get you there.
A 472 .080 overbore X 3.85 stroke and DOVE heads should get you there economically.
Goodluck.
Al
Hey Al you mean .060 dont you Smile

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  Giska1 on Sun 31 Oct 2010 - 22:25

Lem Evans wrote:$784.95 each. heads are assemblied.


What is the price today, P51 ready to innstall Question
And SCJ price ?
Shipped to 18901 Pa

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Re: More power outta 460 with good alum heads or stroker with iron heads?

Post  dfree383 on Mon 1 Nov 2010 - 5:47

Giska1 wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:$784.95 each. heads are assemblied.


What is the price today, P51 ready to innstall Question
And SCJ price ?
Shipped to 18901 Pa

give Lem evans at BF Evans Ford a call, his number is listed on the main sheet.

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