horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  psfracer on January 6th 2011, 1:27 am

Great info -- but I am kinda shocked that the P51 is only 30 cfm off. I know its not all about cfm numbers but I thought the stock Boss 9 heads would flow more then that.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  c.evans on January 6th 2011, 2:16 am

psfracer wrote:Great info -- but I am kinda shocked that the P51 is only 30 cfm off. I know its not all about cfm numbers but I thought the stock Boss 9 heads would flow more then that.

Did you actually get your P-51 heads flow tested, and if so, would you mind sharing those flow numbers with us?

Charlie

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  dfree383 on January 6th 2011, 8:16 am

IMO The Boss 429 heads will do everything a A460 Head will. When max ported they will get in the 470cfm range and may not make as much peak flow as a a460 but the Hemisherical chamber makes them equal.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  4thHorseman on January 6th 2011, 11:28 am

psfracer wrote:Great info -- but I am kinda shocked that the P51 is only 30 cfm off. I know its not all about cfm numbers but I thought the stock Boss 9 heads would flow more then that.

Yeah but look at the exhaust port flow... its way above any P-51 numbers. Shocked
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  Filucky on January 6th 2011, 11:53 am

If they will let ya run the Boss9's that would be cool! They seem to be making some very good numbers from them, and they have some very nice low and mid lift flow numbers for sure. Smile
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  psfracer on January 6th 2011, 5:37 pm

c.evans wrote:
psfracer wrote:Great info -- but I am kinda shocked that the P51 is only 30 cfm off. I know its not all about cfm numbers but I thought the stock Boss 9 heads would flow more then that.

Did you actually get your P-51 heads flow tested, and if so, would you mind sharing those flow numbers with us?

Charlie

NO, good point, I am just going off of the flow numbers posted on the Kaase website. Who knows how close they really are.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  richter69 on January 6th 2011, 7:29 pm

4thHorseman wrote:
psfracer wrote:Great info -- but I am kinda shocked that the P51 is only 30 cfm off. I know its not all about cfm numbers but I thought the stock Boss 9 heads would flow more then that.

Yeah but look at the exhaust port flow... its way above any P-51 numbers. Shocked


Though important, the bigger exhaust numbers are not as big of a factor than one would think.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  KY JELLY on January 7th 2011, 11:12 am

dfree383 wrote:IMO The Boss 429 heads will do everything a A460 Head will. When max ported they will get in the 470cfm range and may not make as much peak flow as a a460 but the Hemisherical chamber makes them equal.

How high of an rpm level do you think they will peak at in an all out application , and how much heavier are the pistons compared to a wedge ?
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  dfree383 on January 7th 2011, 11:26 am

KY JELLY wrote:
dfree383 wrote:IMO The Boss 429 heads will do everything a A460 Head will. When max ported they will get in the 470cfm range and may not make as much peak flow as a a460 but the Hemisherical chamber makes them equal.

How high of an rpm level do you think they will peak at in an all out application , and how much heavier are the pistons compared to a wedge ?

IMO on a 600" motor I'd guess in the 7000rpm range +/- similar to the A460 stuff with a big cam. My 432" engine with a very short @ .050 mechanical roller wanted well over 7000rpm..... Long story.

The Kaase heads have 88cc chambers, they are not typical full hemis requiring a giant piston dome.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  KY JELLY on January 7th 2011, 12:00 pm

dfree383 wrote:
KY JELLY wrote:
dfree383 wrote:IMO The Boss 429 heads will do everything a A460 Head will. When max ported they will get in the 470cfm range and may not make as much peak flow as a a460 but the Hemisherical chamber makes them equal.

How high of an rpm level do you think they will peak at in an all out application , and how much heavier are the pistons compared to a wedge ?

IMO on a 600" motor I'd guess in the 7000rpm range +/- similar to the A460 stuff with a big cam. My 432" engine with a very short @ .050 mechanical roller wanted well over 7000rpm..... Long story.

The Kaase heads have 88cc chambers, they are not typical full hemis requiring a giant piston dome.

If thats the case the only issue I would be concerned with then would be the actual weight of the heads comparing them to an all out p-51. When you get to that level of performance out of any of the heads a 100 lbs is a 100 hp unless the hemi would produce a lot more torque that would favor a heavier car.

That 7000 rpm peak has got to be over come to go faster with a conventional head. I would have to agree with Lem on the A heads especially after seeing what Phillips engine will run . I know its a tunnel ram , but that is one running sob.
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Kasse BOSS 9

Post  Mark Laczo on January 7th 2011, 12:01 pm

Are the Kasse BOSS 9 heads a 10bolt or 18bolt ?

Mark
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  dfree383 on January 7th 2011, 12:04 pm

They are 10 bolt.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  dfree383 on January 7th 2011, 12:06 pm

KY JELLY wrote:
dfree383 wrote:
KY JELLY wrote:
dfree383 wrote:IMO The Boss 429 heads will do everything a A460 Head will. When max ported they will get in the 470cfm range and may not make as much peak flow as a a460 but the Hemisherical chamber makes them equal.

How high of an rpm level do you think they will peak at in an all out application , and how much heavier are the pistons compared to a wedge ?

IMO on a 600" motor I'd guess in the 7000rpm range +/- similar to the A460 stuff with a big cam. My 432" engine with a very short @ .050 mechanical roller wanted well over 7000rpm..... Long story.

The Kaase heads have 88cc chambers, they are not typical full hemis requiring a giant piston dome.

If thats the case the only issue I would be concerned with then would be the actual weight of the heads comparing them to an all out p-51. When you get to that level of performance out of any of the heads a 100 lbs is a 100 hp unless the hemi would produce a lot more torque that would favor a heavier car.

That 7000 rpm peak has got to be over come to go faster with a conventional head. I would have to agree with Lem on the A heads especially after seeing what Phillips engine will run . I know its a tunnel ram , but that is one running sob.
The A460 intakes are better IMO then whats avaliable for the Boss 9 on the shelf, but their is always the sheet metal route........ I'm thinking the Boss 9 and A460 stuff are of a pretty similar weight (or close), but I haven't weighed them.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  BOSS 429 on January 7th 2011, 12:31 pm

Mark Laczo wrote:Are the Kasse BOSS 9 heads a 10bolt or 18bolt ?

Mark


they dont need to be 18 bolt,

its nothing for the 600''hemis and bigger to run 8000

the 498 ar hemis run around 9500

the 650's i see run 7500 making 1250 plus,and sometimes over 8000

how the hemi head works out weights any worry about how heavy the piston is,and if you spend the$$$ you can get a light piston anyway

we spin our 530ish a heads to 8000 plus mostly 8500 ,1000 hp + @8000rpm

you just have to have good parts

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  KY JELLY on January 7th 2011, 1:12 pm

The only issue I was looking at asking the weight of the piston was if you would need to change connecting rods every 40 passes I am more into longevity and not rebuilding the engine every 2 weeks . Longevity is the only reason I would see for a sportsman type feller like my self to build a big mountain hemi to turn less rpm with an ass load of torque. I don't think the hemi head we are talking about is going to offer the same thing an ar head would neither.

I personally do not get all tore up about the "cool" factor of owning a "hemi" and would only recognize the benefit of it offering more room for bigger valves and raised ports all of which the a-head offer also.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  dfree383 on January 7th 2011, 3:16 pm

The Pistons are no heavier with the Kaase Boss 9 heads, Now with A441 and B441 full hemi Chamber the might be a little heavier, but those heads are way above any A460 heads potential.

Keep in mind the Kaase Boss 9 heads are just a updated factory Boss head, not raised port stuff.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  BOSS 429 on January 7th 2011, 8:12 pm

KY JELLY wrote:The only issue I was looking at asking the weight of the piston was if you would need to change connecting rods every 40 passes I am more into longevity and not rebuilding the engine every 2 weeks . Longevity is the only reason I would see for a sportsman type feller like my self to build a big mountain hemi to turn less rpm with an ass load of torque. I don't think the hemi head we are talking about is going to offer the same thing an ar head would neither.

I personally do not get all tore up about the "cool" factor of owning a "hemi" and would only recognize the benefit of it offering more room for bigger valves and raised ports all of which the a-head offer also.

how much power do you want to make?

now about the hemi if you ever switch to one you will never go back to a wedge.....
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  rmcomprandy on January 7th 2011, 8:42 pm

Part of RPM potential is intake valve WEIGHT ... when using steel the A460 intake valve will weigh somewhere in the 170 gram area and the Boss intake valve is about 150 grams.
A Boss9 headed 600 inch race type engine with one 4 barrel ought to make well over 1,000 horsepower "falling off a log" and a lot more in competant hands.

EDIT: The weights are from memory so, that may not be to the exact grams but, real close.


Last edited by rmcomprandy on January 7th 2011, 9:17 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  Lem Evans on January 7th 2011, 9:03 pm

Damn Randy....1st time I've ever seen you wrong Smile The TFS A460 2.350" steel intake valve is only 168.8 gm lol!
The stem lenght of any valve adds to the total wt. ...having said that , the valve lenght of the new JK Boss does not allow for a 'real' valve spring..i.m.o. Unless one does not need much lift.


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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  Lem Evans on January 7th 2011, 9:16 pm

BOSS 429 wrote:
Mark Laczo wrote:Are the Kasse BOSS 9 heads a 10bolt or 18bolt ?

Mark


they dont need to be 18 bolt,

its nothing for the 600''hemis and bigger to run 8000

the 498 ar hemis run around 9500

the 650's i see run 7500 making 1250 plus,and sometimes over 8000

how the hemi head works out weights any worry about how heavy the piston is,and if you spend the$$$ you can get a light piston anyway

we spin our 530ish a heads to 8000 plus mostly 8500 ,1000 hp + @8000rpm

you just have to have good parts




So, making 1,052 @ 6,500 RPM is a bad thing ?

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  LivermoreDave on January 7th 2011, 9:20 pm

Lem Evans wrote:Damn Randy....1st time I've ever seen you wrong Smile


Yea Randy you havin brain fade? I can tell the "Hillbilly Way" is "rubbing off" on Randy, must be all those visits to Philpot! They darn sure ain't no logs in Roseville!

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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  cool40 on January 7th 2011, 9:31 pm

that'd suck^^ Laughing i'd like to have that at any rpm.maybe someday.
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  cool40 on January 7th 2011, 9:35 pm

LivermoreDave wrote:
Lem Evans wrote:Damn Randy....1st time I've ever seen you wrong Smile


Yea Randy you havin brain fade? I can tell the "Hillbilly Way" is "rubbing off" on Randy, must be all those visits to Philpot! They darn sure ain't no logs in Roseville!

Dave.
dam! Dave,now you bump me to the next page and it looks like i want brain fade! Laughing i was talken about Lem's post on HP.i've already got brain fade,,,,...i think,cant realy remember. silent
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  KY JELLY on January 8th 2011, 7:22 am

BOSS 429 wrote:
KY JELLY wrote:The only issue I was looking at asking the weight of the piston was if you would need to change connecting rods every 40 passes I am more into longevity and not rebuilding the engine every 2 weeks . Longevity is the only reason I would see for a sportsman type feller like my self to build a big mountain hemi to turn less rpm with an ass load of torque. I don't think the hemi head we are talking about is going to offer the same thing an ar head would neither.

I personally do not get all tore up about the "cool" factor of owning a "hemi" and would only recognize the benefit of it offering more room for bigger valves and raised ports all of which the a-head offer also.

how much power do you want to make?

now about the hemi if you ever switch to one you will never go back to a wedge.....

I want all the power I can make , but I have no plans to switch to a hemi head. I have a set of p-51's and a set of c - heads If I get the itch to go super fast I will set 2 turbo's in front of them c heads and let-r-rip.

I am not being negative towards the boss 9 and I was just joining in on the conversation of this thread about a conventional boss 9 head . It might be the hot ticket for this gentleman's application. I have not seen any run on the strip yet so I have no real world opinion on them yet. Smile
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Re: horsepower potential af kaase boss 9 heads?

Post  AlkyPinto on January 8th 2011, 12:31 pm

I have and race a Boss 600 in my Pinto. Had it at the 2010 BBF Bash.



Its NOT a max effort race motor. In fact its a very MILD setup
intended to make 200 bracket passes a year. 4.600" bore, 4.500"
stroke, steel rods, 15:1 Diamond pistons (weighing 652 gms),
and out of the box unported Kaase Boss 9 heads. Cam is .721/.780
and I only spin it 6600 rpm. It made 950HP on the dyno on alky
at 6600 rpm. It replaced a Blue Thunder B headed (& ported)
632 motor that had more cam. The Boss ran 3/10ths quicker in
my car with the same ignition and fuel system. Plus the Boss
was 32 ci smaller and at least 50 lbs heavier. IMO there is NO
question the heads make a lot more power then the ported BTs.

Just some real data for what its worth......
Rich
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