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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost)

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Post  quarterflash December 19th 2020, 11:38 pm

I’m going cross eyed searching the internet trying to fill in the blanks “TBD” on this project. The parts in bold have already been acquired. Pistons are my biggest frustration. Haven’t even considered cam choice yet and rods seem easy after pistons are selected. Your input would be greatly appreciated!

Block: D9TE-AB (two available - .060 over or std) Wanted D0VE block but tired of looking locally
Crank: Eagle CRS446041402200 4340 Forged Crank 4.140 Stroke
Rods: GRP Alumimum 6.7
Heads: M-6049-SCJ
Pistons: TBD (Diamond > Budget) Outstanding website though
Cam: TBD
Manifold: BM-5056 429-460 FORD UNPOLISHED BDS INTAKE SATIN
Blower: 6-71 (I know its small but "Budget - Mild Boost")
Injection: Enderle Bird Catcher Fuel will be high octane Gas

This engine will be an upgraded for 1978 Cole Hydro "Quarter Flash".

Thanks in advance for your help.

Steve


Last edited by quarterflash on December 23rd 2020, 10:55 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : Got Rods)
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Post  rmcomprandy December 21st 2020, 5:45 pm

quarterflash wrote:I’m going cross eyed searching the internet trying to fill in the blanks “TBD” on this project. The parts in bold have already been acquired. Pistons are my biggest frustration. Haven’t even considered cam choice yet and rods seem easy after pistons are selected. Your input would be greatly appreciated!

Block: D9TE-AB (two available - .060 over or std) Wanted D0VE block but tired of looking locally
Crank: Eagle CRS446041402200 4340 Forged Crank 4.140 Stroke
Rods: TBD
Heads: M-6049-SCJ
Pistons: TBD (Diamond > Budget) Outstanding website though
Cam: TBD
Manifold: BM-5056 429-460 FORD UNPOLISHED BDS INTAKE SATIN
Blower: 6-71 (I know its small but "Budget - Mild Boost")
Injection: Enderle Bird Catcher

This engine will be an upgraded for 1978 Cole Hydro "Quarter Flash".

Thanks in advance for your help.

Steve

What fuel is to be the intended use ...?
That alone makes a lot of your decisions.

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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost) Empty Fuel Type

Post  quarterflash December 21st 2020, 6:35 pm

I had problems with this post initially and ended up with duplicates. Some where along the way the stated fuel type got lost

Fuel: Gas
Thanks,
Steve
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Post  69F100 December 21st 2020, 7:07 pm

what octane rating you going to use 87, 89, 91, or 93 I see you in Florida so you should be able to get 93 I know we have 93 here in south Georgia
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Post  Uglytruck December 21st 2020, 7:38 pm

As I see it, the problem is going blown gas with an Enderle Bird Catcher. If this is the tradtional mechanical system you may find it tough to get the tuneup right resulting in broken/burned up parts along the way. The usual choice for that kind of deal is methanol as it is easier to tune and gentler on parts.

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Post  quarterflash December 21st 2020, 8:16 pm

The idea of having to purge the fuel system after use seems like a major PIA. I was hoping to stay on the rich side of the tune with gas and avoid problems. Do you feel it would be difficult to do.
Steve
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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost) Empty 110 race fuel

Post  quarterflash December 21st 2020, 9:10 pm

69F100 wrote:what octane rating you going to use 87, 89, 91, or 93 I see you in Florida so you should be able to get 93 I know we have 93 here in south Georgia  

We have 93 non-ethanol available locally but could run on 110 race fuel if needed. Quality fuel is cheaper than parts/labor, plus run time is very short.

Steve
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Post  Uglytruck December 22nd 2020, 12:42 pm

I don't purge my system until I put it to bed at the end of the season.  When I buy a drum of methanol I put in a bottle of top lube like Klotz Uplon or products like it.  As a result, I never have the dreaded white fuzz.  At the end of the season I drain the fuel out of my tank and put in a gallon or so of regular gas and fire it up and let it run fat. Then purge the remaining circuits.  I apologize for throwing this in without actually trying to answer your original question, but fuel type affects what compression ratio to use ect....

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Post  cool40 December 22nd 2020, 2:26 pm

I never purge mine. I leave fuel in it all winter and the pump doesn’t dry out and leak like it will if I drain it. Clean the injectors and fire it up in the spring.
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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost) Empty methanol for fuel

Post  quarterflash December 22nd 2020, 2:31 pm

I have been reading about mechanical fuel injection and methanol. The book I got is "Fuel Injection Racing Secrets - 2nd Edition" written by Bob Szabo. It's clear to me that he feels methanol is the only way to go. My hat is currently setup for it but I did purchase a blown gas barrel valve for it. I got turned off when he started talking about how corrosive it was. Maybe I took the section onf that too seriously. Just couldn't see purging after each outing then dealing with getting the system primed again.

Steve
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Post  cool40 December 22nd 2020, 9:53 pm

It’s definitely not as user friendly as gas and is pretty corrosive. It’s easy to contaminate your oil if it’s not adjusted right or not warmed up good when you do run it. One of the best tips I got from a member on here was to not start it up just to hear it run lol. It’s pretty important to heat it up to 180 or more to burn the moisture out of the oil and use that shut off valve to lean it out and build heat at idle.
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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost) Empty fill in the blanks for a methanol build

Post  quarterflash December 23rd 2020, 8:18 am

Since the conversation here has developed a methanol twist and it sounds more practical, How would the contributors so far fill in the blanks "TBD" for a methanol build. If the gas guys come along later then we'll have that discussion as well.

Thanks,
Steve
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Post  stanger68 December 23rd 2020, 1:13 pm

Looks like it's for a boat. But is it a race boat?

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Post  69F100 December 23rd 2020, 10:05 pm

quarterflash wrote:Since the conversation here has developed a methanol twist and it sounds more practical, How would the contributors so far fill in the blanks "TBD" for a methanol build. If the gas guys come along later then we'll have that discussion as well.

Thanks,
Steve

I run a Ron's 1800 cfm tolit I have a gas primer I fire mine up on I can get mine up to 180* on a quart of pump gas and methanol likes compression so keep that in mind if you decide on running Methanol. My 460 I ran it on methanol with 10.5 compression with a methanol carb. I went to a 552 with 14.5 compression it will fire up easier on 14.5 than the it did on 10.5 with carb. You will burn a little more Methanol then you will on gas so you will not go as far on a tank
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Parts selection for blown application (Budget - Mild Boost) Empty Methanol starting to sound better to me

Post  quarterflash December 23rd 2020, 10:52 pm

I like the idea of higher compression. It seems like you're a cam change away from un-blown gas if you decide to bail on Methanol. I got a good deal on GRP 6.7 rods now my available options are shrinking even more.
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Post  dfree383 December 24th 2020, 8:26 am

What about gas and a pair of carbs?

Cheap, easy to tune and it works very well in mild setups
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Post  quarterflash December 24th 2020, 11:07 am

dfree383 wrote:What about gas and a pair of carbs?

Cheap, easy to tune and it works very well in mild setups

This was the original plan. I bought a pair of QuickFuel 750's and planned to do the Boost Reference modification on them. I ended up getting a reasonable deal on the Birdcatcher so the plan evolved despite others suggesting the hat was more suited for Methonal. I have the QuickFuel 750's on the boat now but still have the original Holley 750's rebuilt and on the shelf. This evolving thought "attention deficit disorder" is documented on my website"dragboatfever.com". The cost of custom pistons is my current hangup. Seems like two sets would be in order 8:1 for gas and 12:1 for Methanol. Then what bore size to allow for future flexibility. As far a Compression ratio is concerned 12:1 would at least allow for blown Methanol and un-blown gas, 8:1 sounds like blown gas only. I'll get thru this but I'm getting a headache.
Steve
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Post  dfree383 December 24th 2020, 11:59 am

The 6-71 would be much better on a shock stroke BBF making 8:1 pistons pretty cheap
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Post  quarterflash December 24th 2020, 12:08 pm

dfree383 wrote:The 6-71 would be much better on a shock stroke BBF making 8:1 pistons pretty cheap

That's where my thoughts began but I wanted a forged crank and none are available 3.85 stroke. I'm starting to think it's a conspiracy.
Steve
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Post  rmcomprandy December 24th 2020, 2:31 pm

quarterflash wrote:
dfree383 wrote:The 6-71 would be much better on a shock stroke BBF making 8:1 pistons pretty cheap

That's where my thoughts began but I wanted a forged crank and none are available 3.85 stroke.  I'm starting to think it's a conspiracy.
Steve

If you can get a 429 heavy truck crank, they are forged at 3.590" stroke which can be modified and offset ground to a 3.87" stroke with a 2.200" rod journal size.
There were probably hundreds done over the tears for those out there who wanted a forged crank with a shorter stroke...

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Post  cstmwgn December 25th 2020, 4:38 pm

I have a D0VE-A block - stock bore in Palmetto with a sonic check - what is it worth to you?
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Post  quarterflash December 25th 2020, 5:14 pm

cstmwgn wrote:I have a D0VE-A block - stock bore in Palmetto with a sonic check - what is it worth to you?

$350 if it has no issues.
Steve
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Post  JBR-3 December 25th 2020, 8:18 pm

Quarterflash, check your messages.

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Post  HPbyGD December 25th 2020, 8:44 pm

I have a set of 4 port upright Hilborn injectors running gasoline on my lake boat and they work well.  I don't know much about the Enderle injectors but have heard they aren't as easy to get the fuel curve good for cruising like the Hilborns.  
                                GD

                 Video                                       https://youtu.be/ne_PAhb43Qc

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Post  quarterflash December 25th 2020, 9:10 pm

HPbyGD wrote:I have a set of 4 port upright Hilborn injectors running gasoline on my lake boat and they work well.  I don't know much about the Enderle injectors but have heard they aren't as easy to get the fuel curve good for cruising like the Hilborns.  
                                GD

                 Video                                       https://youtu.be/ne_PAhb43Qc

I don't think the jackets are rated for 107mph but I'd do it anyway. Love the LOPE.
Thanks for sharing.
Steve
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