GAS TO E-85 carb

Any-one on here work with carbs, turn mine from gas to E-85?

I have a few people that can do it, but would rather give work to gents on here.

thanks

adam

Adam,

im pretty sure quickfuel has a kit for the conversion , give Phillip a call and see if he can do it for you or atleast refer you to someone


and as i was reading about e85 i cam across some of this ...pretty cool stuff

Q & A About E85:


Q: Why should I switch to E85?

A: E85 is a renewable fuel source that is also environmentally friendly. Its performance is comparable to race gas at a fraction of the cost. Your engine will run cooler and your ETs will be less affected by atmospheric changes. E85 is not corrosive like methanol and does not leave carbon deposits like gas so maintenance is reduced across the board. Your oil stays looking like new.


Q: What is the difference in ethanol and methanol?

A: Both fuels have an excellent intake air charge cooling effect. Ethanol (grain or ethyl alcohol) is a biofuel made through the distillation of renewable resources like corn, sugar cane and switch grass. Yes, this is the same process they use to make alcoholic beverages like liquor. Fuel ethanol is 180 proof when produced. 15% regular 87 octane gasoline is added to E100 to add a little lubricant as well as ease the initial cold startup. Methanol (wood alcohol) is produced through a chemical process. By its nature methanol is more corrosive and provides 35% less energy then E85 so you have to burn 35% more of it to make comparable power. E85 cost the same or less then regular unleaded gasoline, methanol cost $4.00 - $5.00 a gallon.


Q: What type of performance can I expect from making the switch to E85?

A: It has been our experience that E85 with its 105 octane rating and high tolerance to detonation is superior to premium pump gas and equal to and in most cases better than 110 octane race gas. We picked up a tenth of a second and 2 to 3 miles per hour in the eighth mile after switching to E85 from 110 race gas and our engine runs 20 degrees cooler.


Q: What will I be saving from running E85 over racing gas?

A: 110 race gas sells for $7.00 a gallon at the track; E85 is around $2.50 a gallon at the pump. The cost of a Race on E85 conversion kit for a 4150 style carb is $250.00 let’s see: You burn roughly 1/2 gallon of fuel on a run so you would save $2.25 on fuel per run. You will be going green both environmentally and financially every time you fire your race car.


Q: Don’t I have to replace all the “rubber” in my fuel system so it want be eaten up by the alcohol in E85?

A: NO!!! We started out on this journey with a complete gasoline system. We upped the flow 30% to compensate for the lower heat energy output of ethanol and left everything else the same just to see the effects. We switched to E85 at the end of the 2006 racing season and to date we have found zero deterioration or corrosion anywhere in our fuel system. We leave it in the system all the time. We don’t drain anything between races or use any type of fuel lube.


Q: How much compression can I run with E85 fuel just the way it comes out of the pump at my local station?

A: This is one question I don't have a concrete answer for. We are running it in engines up to 14.5:1 naturally aspirated and some fairly high boost forced induction applications with great results. I have seen charts that draw the line at 16:1 but there again I just don’t have the data yet of a failure directly due to the compression limit of pump grade E85 being reached.


Q: Where can I find E85 in this area?

A: You can find E85 in any area by logging onto www.e85fuel.com and just click on your state for a list of stations that carry it.

TUNING TIPS
1. No matter what type of fuel system you are running you must increase flow (volume) by roughly 30% over a (gas) setup. This is more than just increasing the main jets (in a carburetor) by 30%. Flow must be increased throughout the whole system and fuel curve.
2. Start out with your total timing the same as on gas then adjust for best mph.
3. Water temp. needs to be 140 - 150 degrees when you pull into the water box and at least 160 degrees when you stage. Your jetting is close when you gain about 10 degrees in the 1/8th and about 20 degrees in the quarter.
4. If you have the luxury of tuning with a wide band air/fuel ratio meter we have found that it is very easy to use the lambda scale. We tune for 1 at idle and .82 to .83 @ WOT for best (safe) power. If you use an EGT meter to tune with you know that ideal temps. will vary greatly from one combination to another. It has been our finding that if you keep it below 1500 degrees while you are sorting out your tune up you don't have to worry about hurting anything in the process. We have found that most naturally aspirated combinations end up making best power between 1150 and 1250 degrees on E85. Forced induction applications usually run 100 to 200 degrees hotter. If you need a good "inexpensive" EGT meter check out http://www.ifamilysoftware.com/8307.html
5. E85 has a high resistance to knock but lights off easy so it is susceptible to pre-ignition. A non protruding tip plug is recommended. Autolite Racing plugs with the cut back strap work well for us. We run AR-133 with the blower, this is a little cooler then you would need for natural aspiration. When reading your plugs look for them to be real clean with a little tan color down inside the threads on the porcelain. If no color appears after the first couple of runs, jet up until some starts to show then adjust jetting for best mph from there. Here is a helpful cross reference chart. http://www.autolite.com/pdf/RacingCrossRef.pdf

There is a guy that specializes in these conversions, he is not a member here, but from what I've seen on the other forums he is on he knows his E85.

HERE IS ANOTHER SITE SHOWING A DIY

http://www.brokenboltgarage.net/E85.htm

richter69 wrote:There is a guy that specializes in these conversions, he is not a member here, but from what I've seen on the other forums he is on he knows his E85.

There is a guy (Eric68) on the WEST side of the state of Michigan, that knows his shit.. www.horsepowerinnovations.com
about $400 a carb (Blower, 1050 dommies) to switch, and he will flow, tweek tune, them for my application, <BLOWER>

I was just looking for some one on here that could do them for me. Other-wise I'll go with Eric...

adam

have you heard about the end of e-85

http://www.brighterenergy.org/20150/news/bioenergy/senators-demand-end-to-ethanol-subsidy-and-tariff/

bruno wrote:HERE IS ANOTHER SITE SHOWING A DIY

http://www.brokenboltgarage.net/E85.htm

NICE!!!

Spotted AL gORE..............

Until the "powers that be" tighten up the restrictions on E85, it is not necessarily a good fuel to be running in a high performance, carbureted engine.
Right now, E85 is publicly said to be 15% gasoline and 85% ethanol however, the mixture can ACTUALLY be anywhere from 60% to 90% ethanol and still be within government tollerance, which could require constant jet changes the get the fuel/air mixture to the engine correct. Most dual-fuel injected vehicles have the ability to make enrichment adjustments "on the fly", carburetors DON'T.
Be picky about where you get your fuel and buy a test kit to find out the actual ethanol content before filling a tankful, when you are using a carburetor.

rmcomprandy wrote:Until the "powers that be" tighten up the restrictions on E85, it is not necessarily a good fuel to be running in a high performance, carbureted engine.
Right now, E85 is publicly said to be 15% gasoline and 85% ethanol however, the mixture can ACTUALLY be anywhere from 60% to 90% ethanol and still be within government tollerance, which could require constant jet changes the get the fuel/air mixture to the engine correct. Most dual-fuel injected vehicles have the ability to make enrichment adjustments "on the fly", carburetors DON'T.
Be picky about where you get your fuel and buy a test kit to find out the actual ethanol content before filling a tankful, when you are using a carburetor.

does folks like vp sell e-85 in drums ..... i would think that would be pretty consistent

Check this site out http://www.raceone85.com/


It is hard to keep your tune right with high compression engines and it is not good for it to sit in a carb for a long time .An as Randy said you never know what the reading on it will be from one time to another.

bruno wrote:

rmcomprandy wrote:Until the "powers that be" tighten up the restrictions on E85, it is not necessarily a good fuel to be running in a high performance, carbureted engine.
Right now, E85 is publicly said to be 15% gasoline and 85% ethanol however, the mixture can ACTUALLY be anywhere from 60% to 90% ethanol and still be within government tollerance, which could require constant jet changes the get the fuel/air mixture to the engine correct. Most dual-fuel injected vehicles have the ability to make enrichment adjustments "on the fly", carburetors DON'T.
Be picky about where you get your fuel and buy a test kit to find out the actual ethanol content before filling a tankful, when you are using a carburetor.

does folks like vp sell e-85 in drums ..... i would think that would be pretty consistent

Because it is a blended fuel I have to agree. VP does have some e10- e30 fuels from looking at their spec sheets. If you want to run any blended fuel consistently I would invest in something to monitor the mix ratio. Off the shelf instrument does exist using an OEM flex fuel sensor.
http://www.zeitronix.com/Products/ECA/ECA.htm
The meter itself is not too costly but a new OEM sensor is expensive. The sensor can not handle the high flow fuel requirements to be place in the fuel line so most that are running it are placing a Y fitting in the return line for the sensor.

If your serious about running e-85 go look at Rockett Brand fuels as they offer e-85 and e-98. E-98 will allow you to mix your own fuel.
http://www.rockettbrand.com/techsupport/matsafetydata.html


ETA: dang been so long since I have posted on the board I about forgot how. For those that don't recognize the name I am monstermiler from the other board.

blown86hallet wrote:

richter69 wrote:There is a guy that specializes in these conversions, he is not a member here, but from what I've seen on the other forums he is on he knows his E85.

There is a guy (Eric68) on the WEST side of the state of Michigan, that knows his shit.. www.horsepowerinnovations.com
about $400 a carb (Blower, 1050 dommies) to switch, and he will flow, tweek tune, them for my application, <BLOWER>

I was just looking for some one on here that could do them for me. Other-wise I'll go with Eric...

adam

I know Eric well... used to sell him parts on a regular basis at my old workplace. He definitely knows his stuff and is just a good guy in general... I wouldn't hesitate to buy from him.

Pretty sure Eric is the guy I was telling you about.

Well....

I'll chat with him again!

thanks gents....

adam

bruno wrote:

rmcomprandy wrote:Until the "powers that be" tighten up the restrictions on E85, it is not necessarily a good fuel to be running in a high performance, carbureted engine.
Right now, E85 is publicly said to be 15% gasoline and 85% ethanol however, the mixture can ACTUALLY be anywhere from 60% to 90% ethanol and still be within government tollerance, which could require constant jet changes the get the fuel/air mixture to the engine correct. Most dual-fuel injected vehicles have the ability to make enrichment adjustments "on the fly", carburetors DON'T.
Be picky about where you get your fuel and buy a test kit to find out the actual ethanol content before filling a tankful, when you are using a carburetor.

does folks like vp sell e-85 in drums ..... i would think that would be pretty consistent

People around here who are using it in leau of race gas are testing the fuel at several stations. Then, when they find one which has the consistancy they desire, take one of their own drums to that station and fill it up for use.
It does absorb moisture so, you can't buy a lot of it ahead of time.

For racing just buy E98 and cut it with fuel your self to make it consistent.... I'm looking to make the switch because I have 3 race cars and racing fuel isn't cheap. $7.50-$8.75 a gallon. The E85 stuff would be $2.50 a gallon....

Ace

Wow, didn't realize how many stations close to me were selling E-85. I got 11 stations within 45 miles that have it, the closest is only about 7 miles away. I would also think that since the fuel suppler I get bulk Kerosene from also carries racing gas, maybe they also have E-85 in a drum.

Dave if there's a race fuel supplier they will most likely have E98 as well or E85. You can call them in the spring and have them test there fuel and buy drums of the stuff. My local supplier would only sell to the Track but has loosen there belts just to sell to any buddy thats willing to buy 55 gallon barrels and will not charge a barrel fee like other fuel sources ( $55).

Ace

This might be a little pricey but its worth a shot for those that want E100

http://www.e85performance.net/forums/showthread.php?t=617


Ace

blown86hallet wrote:Any-one on here work with carbs, turn mine from gas to E-85?

I have a few people that can do it, but would rather give work to gents on here.

thanks

adam

Check with Carl... near the bottom of this page, under services.
http://www.carsbycarl.com/Parts.html

I have been using it for two years now bracket racing and I love it untill it get cold (under 50 degrees) it gets hard to to start I got a gas primer system to shoot gas into the intake to get it started it is fine after that kinda like alky, that has been the only issue. The oil stays clean, runs cooler and a hell of allot cheaper. I purchased a quick fuel E-85 carb and had larger boosters installed by Mark Sullens and tuned it myself it is deadly consistant. I take a drum to the gas station and fill her up, to check it and adjust carb to it very rarly is it below 85% most of the time it is 88-87% until 1st of Nov. then they drop it to 75 % I try to make sure I have a drum full before that happens . I have spoke with Eric and he know his stuff also check out Heath @http://raceone85.com/ also Mark does good work, these are the top three from what I have found. Got any questions just ask.

BIGDOG466 wrote:I have been using it for two years now bracket racing and I love it untill it get cold (under 50 degrees) it gets hard to to start I got a gas primer system to shoot gas into the intake to get it started it is fine after that kinda like alky, that has been the only issue. The oil stays clean, runs cooler and a hell of allot cheaper. I purchased a quick fuel E-85 carb and had larger boosters installed by Mark Sullens and tuned it myself it is deadly consistant. I take a drum to the gas station and fill her up, to check it and adjust carb to it very rarly is it below 85% most of the time it is 88-87% until 1st of Nov. then they drop it to 75 % I try to make sure I have a drum full before that happens . I have spoke with Eric and he know his stuff also check out Heath @http://raceone85.com/ also Mark does good work, these are the top three from what I have found. Got any questions just ask.

DO you use any kind of wideband system to help tune the car?

Ace

I use a LM2 & watch the lambda I think each combo wants to be tuned different from what I have seen as far as consistantcy. I run mine leaner that some of the chevy boys. I will adjust air bleeds to get the curve for my combo.