514 Roller setup Lifter noise
+9
Scott Foxwell
torino501
4604X4
supervel45
BBFTorino
rmcomprandy
SandHillsHillbilly
dfree383
OldRed70
13 posters
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514 Roller setup Lifter noise
I need some help !!! Got a 514 hydraulic roller setup, new rebuild less than 1000 miles .Engine runs great but lifters sound like they are coming out of the engine. But the noise comes and goes. Oil pressure at idle is 35-38 psi and driving at 3000 rpm oil pressure is 50-55 psi steady.
What I have done to try and fix noise. This is a front sump oil pan.
Installed windage tray
Installed baffles in oil pan
Increased capacity of oil pan to 10 quarts
All internal parts were new when engine was built
Comp cam, lifters, springs, & Comp gold roller rickers
I am at wits end trying to figure this out, I am leaning towards bad lifters...
Any Ideas ???????????????
What I have done to try and fix noise. This is a front sump oil pan.
Installed windage tray
Installed baffles in oil pan
Increased capacity of oil pan to 10 quarts
All internal parts were new when engine was built
Comp cam, lifters, springs, & Comp gold roller rickers
I am at wits end trying to figure this out, I am leaning towards bad lifters...
Any Ideas ???????????????
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
What part number lifters? What oil? How are you setting the lifters?
dfree383- BBF CONTRIBUTOR
- Posts : 14800
Join date : 2009-07-09
Location : Home Wif Da Wife.....
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
8934-16
Valvoline VR1 20W-50
I have set them at 0 lash to 3/4 turn past 0 lash with same results
Valvoline VR1 20W-50
I have set them at 0 lash to 3/4 turn past 0 lash with same results
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Switch to a thinner oil. Some of the Hydraulic Roller lifters do not like thick oil besides that is extra load you are placing on the pump and drive. You don't really need that thick of oil unless you are placing a heavy crank load and compensating for large clearances. Try a 5W30 or nothing heavier than 40wt.
SandHillsHillbilly- Posts : 240
Join date : 2008-12-02
Age : 63
Location : South Carolina
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
I don't know who is making Comps Hyd Roller Lifters but it might be Morel. Here are two documents you need to read that might help you some.
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/AdjustingMorelHydraulicLifters.pdf
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/Types%20of%20Hydraulic%20Lifters.pdf
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/AdjustingMorelHydraulicLifters.pdf
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/Types%20of%20Hydraulic%20Lifters.pdf
SandHillsHillbilly- Posts : 240
Join date : 2008-12-02
Age : 63
Location : South Carolina
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Will definitely be changing the oil this weekend .
I used the 1st article to set lash when we put the engine together.
Thanks !!!
I used the 1st article to set lash when we put the engine together.
Thanks !!!
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
SandHillsHillbilly wrote:I don't know who is making Comps Hyd Roller Lifters but it might be Morel. Here are two documents you need to read that might help you some.
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/AdjustingMorelHydraulicLifters.pdf
http://johncalliesinc.com/pdf/Types%20of%20Hydraulic%20Lifters.pdf
Comp hydraulic roller lifters are definitely NOT Morel ... all except their short travel race type lifters, they have an excessive leak down issue in every application I have ever heard about.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Zero lash and 3/4 turn seems excessive. Try zero lash and 1/4 turn, run it and see what it does.
BBFTorino- Posts : 985
Join date : 2015-12-31
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
BBFTorino wrote:Zero lash and 3/4 turn seems excessive. Try zero lash and 1/4 turn, run it and see what it does.
I think he may already have tried that? I suspect the thinner old will make them louder, we'll see. Almost starting to sound like the old VVT's.
supervel45- Posts : 4460
Join date : 2013-09-04
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
^^^^^^^^^^OldRed70 wrote:8934-16
Valvoline VR1 20W-50
I have set them at 0 lash to 3/4 turn past 0 lash with same results
supervel45- Posts : 4460
Join date : 2013-09-04
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Yeah I have adjusted 0 lash, 1/4 past 0, 1/2 past 0, & 3/4 past 0. All with the same results.
If I change out the lifters, Any suggestions on what to use ?
If I change out the lifters, Any suggestions on what to use ?
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Have you tried bottoming them out, then lashing
And definetly get some thinner oil
And definetly get some thinner oil
dfree383- BBF CONTRIBUTOR
- Posts : 14800
Join date : 2009-07-09
Location : Home Wif Da Wife.....
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
This might be helpful (but this advise if for Crane hydraulic roller lifters - so maybe doesn't apply to Comp lifters):
From Crane:
http://cranecams.com.au/pdfs/pp1110c.pdf
Another important instance are those engines that are
equipped with Crane Cams 8620 steel billet hydraulic
roller lifters. Due to the excellent strength and stability of
these lifters, 1–¼ to 1–½ turns of preload can be used,
resulting in a reduced oil volume in each lifter, allowing more
consistent operation and stability throughout RPM range.
I have the Crane "Retrofit" Hydraulic Roller Lifters (#35532) in my build.
I occasionally get a lifter tapping after starting (I think the lifter in cly 7 or 8 may be bleeding down too much). Preload is set at 1 to 1-1/4 turns.
Scotty (Mad Porter) said he like to run solid roller lifters with his hydraulic roller cam installations - so maybe that is a good choice for us.
From Crane:
http://cranecams.com.au/pdfs/pp1110c.pdf
Another important instance are those engines that are
equipped with Crane Cams 8620 steel billet hydraulic
roller lifters. Due to the excellent strength and stability of
these lifters, 1–¼ to 1–½ turns of preload can be used,
resulting in a reduced oil volume in each lifter, allowing more
consistent operation and stability throughout RPM range.
I have the Crane "Retrofit" Hydraulic Roller Lifters (#35532) in my build.
I occasionally get a lifter tapping after starting (I think the lifter in cly 7 or 8 may be bleeding down too much). Preload is set at 1 to 1-1/4 turns.
Scotty (Mad Porter) said he like to run solid roller lifters with his hydraulic roller cam installations - so maybe that is a good choice for us.
Last edited by 4604X4 on April 20th 2017, 11:21 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : add word "solid")
4604X4- Posts : 108
Join date : 2012-06-24
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
dfree383 wrote:Have you tried bottoming them out, then lashing
As Dave has said, with those excessive leak-down lifters, I have adjusted them using a dial indicator.
Get a slightly longer pushrod than normal.
Put the indicator on the retainer and tighten them till you find the lifter bottoming, then back them off a 1/4 turn, about .010"/.015" from there.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
What valve spring are you running? Specs?
torino501- Posts : 417
Join date : 2013-05-08
Location : THE GREAT STATE OF TEXAS!!!
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
How are you measuring for push rod length? What does your rocker geometry look like? Might not sound relative, but it can be.
X2 on thinner oil, but IMO you should just get rid of those lifters.
How much spring pressure?
One other thought is oil level (not capacity)...if your oil level is too high you may be having windage issues (even with a windage tray) and that can cause oil aeration which can cause erratic lifter performance.
Just some thoughts.
X2 on thinner oil, but IMO you should just get rid of those lifters.
How much spring pressure?
One other thought is oil level (not capacity)...if your oil level is too high you may be having windage issues (even with a windage tray) and that can cause oil aeration which can cause erratic lifter performance.
Just some thoughts.
Scott Foxwell- Posts : 419
Join date : 2011-06-23
Age : 65
Location : E Tennessee
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
I am running what came with the Edelbrock Performer EDL- 60665 are the head part number.
1.530 OD with max lift .730. We used adjustable pushrod checkers. I also had to file the edges of tips on the tips because they were a little to close for my comfort on the spring retainers. I have had the oil level above the full line on dipstick and even ran it on the low side of the add mark. The results were the same. The one thing I have noticed is when the rattling starts my oil pressure will drop to around 35psi for just a split second and I can rev the engine and lifters noise will go away.
1.530 OD with max lift .730. We used adjustable pushrod checkers. I also had to file the edges of tips on the tips because they were a little to close for my comfort on the spring retainers. I have had the oil level above the full line on dipstick and even ran it on the low side of the add mark. The results were the same. The one thing I have noticed is when the rattling starts my oil pressure will drop to around 35psi for just a split second and I can rev the engine and lifters noise will go away.
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
With a max spring pressure of 320
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
take the engine apart,something is wrong,and dont even think about using thinner oil
BOSS 429- Posts : 2368
Join date : 2009-08-10
Location : Ill
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Sounds to me like maybe a poor seal at the oil pump mount flange or a leaking pump pickup tube.
maverick- BBF CONTRIBUTOR
- Posts : 3059
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 72
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
BOSS 429 wrote:take the engine apart,something is wrong,and DEFINITELY think about using thinner oil
Scott Foxwell- Posts : 419
Join date : 2011-06-23
Age : 65
Location : E Tennessee
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Scott Foxwell wrote:BOSS 429 wrote:take the engine apart,something is wrong,and DEFINITELY think about using thinner oil
OK Shell, Let him run it instead of taking it apart and finding whats really wrong, and adding thinner oil,lol
BOSS 429- Posts : 2368
Join date : 2009-08-10
Location : Ill
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Sounds like an oil pump issue to me. What oil pump do you have? I had a similar problem where the pressure would only go so high (about 60 psi max) and the pump was cracked and leaking at the base where it bolts to the block...
jbozzelle- Posts : 3705
Join date : 2009-08-10
Age : 49
Location : New Orleans
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
maverick wrote:Sounds to me like maybe a poor seal at the oil pump mount flange or a leaking pump pickup tube.
jbozzelle wrote:Sounds like an oil pump issue to me. What oil pump do you have? I had a similar problem where the pressure would only go so high (about 60 psi max) and the pump was cracked and leaking at the base where it bolts to the block...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
JMO.
maverick- BBF CONTRIBUTOR
- Posts : 3059
Join date : 2009-08-06
Age : 72
Re: 514 Roller setup Lifter noise
Melting HV with bolt on pickup tube, front Sump. I thought the same thing . That's when I pulled engine and enlarged oil pan also baffled , also installed a windage tray . Also installed a brand new pump and pickup tube . Still with the same Result
OldRed70- Posts : 155
Join date : 2011-12-03
Age : 54
Location : Valdosta Ga.
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