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Stroker Heads and Cam....

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Mark Miller
supervel45
Dave De
1EFF100
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Post  Dave De September 26th 2022, 9:13 pm

1EFF100 wrote:Well, picked up a new bare set of AFR 280s. Was going to have to buy new spring packages anyhow, so might as well buy new valves, screw-in studs and guide plates as well. Very Happy
Now to find someone who can properly machine the pistons for the AFR intake valve notch. Kind of need to find someone relatively quick as the parts are all at the machine shop ready to be balanced.

If you had the parts you could mock it up and use a piston cutter and cut the relief with your heads. You can do this after your parts come back including the balance. The amount of weight coming off the piston is rather insignificant.
A cutter source
https://www.lindytools.com/ihpc
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Post  supervel45 September 27th 2022, 1:00 am

1EFF100 wrote:Well, picked up a new bare set of AFR 280s. Was going to have to buy new spring packages anyhow, so might as well buy new valves, screw-in studs and guide plates as well. Very Happy
Now to find someone who can properly machine the pistons for the AFR intake valve notch. Kind of need to find someone relatively quick as the parts are all at the machine shop ready to be balanced.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Randy mentioned awhile back the A443 cam worked on the SVO crate engines with the CJ cuts with the new then, SCJ's but, they notched the pistons for the C-460 cam as they only had .040" clearance with it.

Your lift "if" you use the F-46 .563" Intake Lift Crane will also have lash of .026" so the intake lift .537" compared to Intake Lift of .562" of the A443 and .588" of the C460 cam, since it is mechanical. So less lift due to the lash but, still a little more duration then the 234 of the A443.

You also have a big Dish that those did not. You worst spot is towards the radial edge but Inboard, not at the cylinder wall. I am pretty sure Doug had flat tops with regular CJ notch's. He also had a bigger cam.

You are moving the valve inboard now with the ARF head, not to the edge of the cylinder.

It's free to check if you can get every thing in one place and have time and on those ARF's like Dave and Doug said you can Buzz them in the Bore.

What I am getting at is I doubt you will have to cut much if any but, you gotta check!

The Crane may have been at a 99 ICL if you advanced it the last time you ran it in the truck with the 3 keyway sprocket. Something to think about.

Also like Dave mentioned it will not matter with the balancing and I "assume"  you have free floating rods.

You can pull the rods off if you where thinking of doing the piston jig deal.

You can also make a cutter out of a old valve bigger then the one you are using in your heads for the radial clearance.

It work's on bigger valves to, in a pinch and I don't think you will cut much anyway if at all. Use a collar for depth and maybe a washer over the PC seals or just mark the cutter and go slow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jpk2pKASjBE

The notch photo I posted with the old CJ cut added is running a 268/278 .718" Roller. It gives some idea of the depth between the smaller cams.

https://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/89038

https://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/88801

^^^^ I put this up for some of the other folks that maybe trying to get a handle on this deal also.

If you do have to Fly Cut it may help other people down the road with a similar build as there does not seem to be much out there on the AFR's. Cool

I remember when the standard port Eddies came out everyone was saying it was a cross between the DOVE's and CJ's and was a Aluminum PI with a D Port exhaust. Nothing wrong with that but I think the AFR's are better for the big cube higher HP deals.

Cool Glad that you found a pair.

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Post  1EFF100 September 27th 2022, 11:33 am

Dave De wrote:
1EFF100 wrote:Well, picked up a new bare set of AFR 280s. Was going to have to buy new spring packages anyhow, so might as well buy new valves, screw-in studs and guide plates as well. Very Happy
Now to find someone who can properly machine the pistons for the AFR intake valve notch. Kind of need to find someone relatively quick as the parts are all at the machine shop ready to be balanced.

If you had the parts you could mock it up and use a piston cutter and cut the relief with your heads. You can do this after your parts come back including the balance. The amount of weight coming off the piston is rather insignificant.
A cutter source
https://www.lindytools.com/ihpc
If that's the case regarding the piston weight, then I'll have my machinest move forward on the balancing.
Thanks Dave, I appreciate it.
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Post  supervel45 September 28th 2022, 1:15 am

Did you hear the PTV clearance Cheese Wiz Cracker joke? I still get a chuckle out of that one? Very Happy

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Post  supervel45 September 30th 2022, 11:37 pm

Looks like big Cleveland Valves you were hunting at the unnamed place. They are not cheap. At Least the high end Manley's.
https://www.airflowresearch.com/afr-7551-bbf-11-32-stainless-steel-2-250-x-5-245-o-a-l-race-intake-valve/

https://www.jegs.com/i/Manley/660/11874-8/10002/-1?gclid=CjwKCAjwp9qZBhBkEiwAsYFsbwMTphTneD0JLgBDCN5GbXODishtFg3F31tjiCsr0NBkEdixCwlQnRoCiOgQAvD_BwE

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/man-11802-8#overview



Same as a 429CJ. What else is so special about them?

SI says the 429CJ are cut on a 30 degree seat.

They come in a 10 or 12 degree angle radius. Are the AFR's something else?

http://www.manleyperformance.com/dl/cat/valves.pdf

http://sivalves.com/pdfs/2016-SI-Catalog.pdf   SI #2157SG or SGB in Black Night Series at 5.288"
^ SI would likely be the cheapest.

Paul Kane had a bunch of very nice SS back cut valves not that long ago, might check with him.

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Post  supervel45 October 1st 2022, 1:42 am

https://www.ebay.com/itm/323800467459?hash=item4b64030803:g:yKgAAOSw1eFdJmMK&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4A5T224qedz44XTDtiTXZeMjo0SRxffq9r%2FGghtLxhe%2B0PcxnpkB%2Flsap5Bd50CqE%2FJBV%2FwPy3Oa%2Bw8rJZhSG4aHP4TBZLJCllBH7oZt1n3GWQ2wu4er25UJXutsAWm5Cv9zkgWbYoK4cLe5wQIkiIlbEvMIzkPXOGO4CCNgQOKIvLgQa835CJeQJQ86eb0WSlGuhDB5vXUEoeIwM70o1tBdbcFvh4VXhBQQp1po8xRMAJWsP9bkjXu5RnI8CBKMjXh3TSpgnsyOBdfWq8jEvHl0n7Inwm9FGv10zizNH2lh%7Ctkp%3ABFBM3NmYoPJg

1.76 Ferrea 5000 Series Exhaust

https://www.ebay.com/itm/170784819224?epid=0&hash=item27c3918818:g:gsYAAOSw3pVZxR02&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoM6p5sNR9YnPUgaYTKhyea8SQ4CU27Mw4t75ZpDF%2FsR0IQfa4Fvr9qc5%2BAoJfC5bmCwuu0CDj44aH6eaxICV0DuKWGXaAUJFwjL3n5WQK27BxIKDENlvDOFFseWadIV7rIh0BRGTmCZbEhPUUN4BPmAd88RjXqvg2BihftIZ4D8QzM3k18Lyaztk6kGIDHc%2FZUpbd57giPMIhNXZyCy%2Fwz8%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5iJs5_yYA

2.25 Ferrea 5000 Series Intake.

ARF Spec's

https://www.airflowresearch.com/afr-7553-bbf-11-32-stainless-steel-1-760-x-5-050-o-a-l-race-exhaust-valve/
https://www.airflowresearch.com/afr-7551-bbf-11-32-stainless-steel-2-250-x-5-245-o-a-l-race-intake-valve/

Hopefully you got a good deal on the bare heads. The other parts add up quick.

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Post  1EFF100 October 1st 2022, 7:20 am

supervel45 wrote:https://www.ebay.com/itm/323800467459?hash=item4b64030803:g:yKgAAOSw1eFdJmMK&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4A5T224qedz44XTDtiTXZeMjo0SRxffq9r%2FGghtLxhe%2B0PcxnpkB%2Flsap5Bd50CqE%2FJBV%2FwPy3Oa%2Bw8rJZhSG4aHP4TBZLJCllBH7oZt1n3GWQ2wu4er25UJXutsAWm5Cv9zkgWbYoK4cLe5wQIkiIlbEvMIzkPXOGO4CCNgQOKIvLgQa835CJeQJQ86eb0WSlGuhDB5vXUEoeIwM70o1tBdbcFvh4VXhBQQp1po8xRMAJWsP9bkjXu5RnI8CBKMjXh3TSpgnsyOBdfWq8jEvHl0n7Inwm9FGv10zizNH2lh%7Ctkp%3ABFBM3NmYoPJg

1.76 Ferrea  5000 Series Exhaust

https://www.ebay.com/itm/170784819224?epid=0&hash=item27c3918818:g:gsYAAOSw3pVZxR02&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoM6p5sNR9YnPUgaYTKhyea8SQ4CU27Mw4t75ZpDF%2FsR0IQfa4Fvr9qc5%2BAoJfC5bmCwuu0CDj44aH6eaxICV0DuKWGXaAUJFwjL3n5WQK27BxIKDENlvDOFFseWadIV7rIh0BRGTmCZbEhPUUN4BPmAd88RjXqvg2BihftIZ4D8QzM3k18Lyaztk6kGIDHc%2FZUpbd57giPMIhNXZyCy%2Fwz8%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5iJs5_yYA

2.25 Ferrea  5000 Series Intake.

ARF Spec's

https://www.airflowresearch.com/afr-7553-bbf-11-32-stainless-steel-1-760-x-5-050-o-a-l-race-exhaust-valve/
https://www.airflowresearch.com/afr-7551-bbf-11-32-stainless-steel-2-250-x-5-245-o-a-l-race-intake-valve/

Hopefully you got a good deal on the bare heads. The other parts add up quick.
Lol, tell me about it. That's why I posed the question at the other forum. I was hoping Scott had the stuff in stock and for sale at a better price than AFR.
Honestly at this point, I'm seriously considering just buying a set of Eddys and be done with it. No notching the pistons and buying a bunch of hardware, just bolt on and go. I know they don't make the most power, but one of the things I've always liked about Edelbrock is their ease of use; they bolt on and line up perfectly with everything else. I'd resell the AFRs and hopefully get my money back out of them, or at least close to it.
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Post  dfree383 October 1st 2022, 7:59 am

The eddys are fine heads and will get you pretty good bump over stock, especially if you have a D3 headed engine now and use the small chamber heads.
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Post  1EFF100 October 1st 2022, 8:22 am

dfree383 wrote:The eddys are fine heads and will get you pretty good bump over stock, especially if you have a D3 headed engine now and use the small chamber heads.
What I have now is a set of Scott Johnston ported, big valve D0VEs. Really the only reason I'm wanting aluminum is for the better heat dissipation for detonation resistance, being this is a street pump gas engine. Lighter weight is always cool as well.
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Post  supervel45 October 1st 2022, 11:04 am

The AFR's have some really nice low lift numbers.

https://www.airflowresearch.com/280cc-bbf-cylinder-head/

Looks like $5-600 more to set them up from bare and that's without the fancy severe duty valves and super duper keepers.

You are right about them being a pain in the ass though and not bolt on friendly.

If you would have got them complete and with a intake it would be less of a hassle.

The way things are going you might flip them for a profit.

The TFS 325's are more then the SR-71's were now LoL.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/321946171009

TFS 290's at a good price assuming they are really in stock, which I doubt same as the 325's above.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/321946170467?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201210111314%26meid%3D74a2503aaaa44f989c3a0a5dd4e605e5%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D321946171009%26itm%3D321946170467%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv11WebTrimmedV3MskuAspectsV202110NoVariantSeedKnnRecallV1%26brand%3DTrick+Flow&_trksid=p2047675.c101195.m1851&amdata=cksum%3A32194617046774a2503aaaa44f989c3a0a5dd4e605e5%7Cenc%3AAQAHAAABIMFr2e4EmAnM%252ByHZkULYKDIJ4L66fOjNL0iupgt%252BzO1%252F3AE1t3mNirUYB96NktMCicMagiS6mbeTl0xquGODv9kRgv1lxU%252FRdPgTZoOOe0HB78Vyi8I33ccpcxtaZd3Dcv7yQ2neCvJDZ23oHxAlkQABeuTPWw3LwgTmfNER7OkgDTrmgtGYzb696ye6eFph0a1uXh%252B5C1akRSkH9uahzmsNosse1eTYN8O6Hgqw4eKPZBhBM44KB7z0NYNNUCRZDjeEH23DPsWtCfsm7XwFYFIqZWMJDzJLYx10mIAi3AxSHo2YYCmJa2ghttunArZgMcJ1xEEmu9uECFRAivTSwlyrGJafBkAGBslUZelGH%252BAbPRBbLvvmFH2cQzAUFex%252Bdw%253D%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2047675&epid=1030176772

Cast Iron is starting to look better every day.

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Post  1EFF100 October 1st 2022, 4:22 pm

I messaged those guys a couple weeks ago regarding the 325s and asked them if they indeed had them in stock and ready for immediate shipping. I have yet to receive a reply.
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Post  Dave De October 1st 2022, 5:10 pm

I heard SCJ's are in stock. Lem may have them and if he doesnt see when he can get them. I have an order in for P-51's thru a friend that no longer needs them. I will be buying them from him and putting them on the shelf when they arrive.
I have those Edels and they arent worth the effort. I will sell them when the engine comes out next year.
As far as valves, Ford Motorsports always had good valves for reasonable prices. I hope that still is the case in this day of not being able to get much of anything.
Another thing to keep stock on.... Next time I order a Roll Master I'm going to get two for double pinned cams.
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Post  1EFF100 October 3rd 2022, 9:29 pm

Well, after all this, I've decided to just run the ported D0VEs. Took them in just for a check-up and they ended up needing a couple guides and a valve job. I have the heads, block and stroker kit all back now and the assembly will begin shortly. It will be kind of neat to see what numbers this combo. will put out.
There's a shop--Ellsworth Performance-- right next to my work and they have a chassis dyno. When the car's back together, I'll have them give it a pull or two and see what kind of numbers we get.
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Post  supervel45 October 3rd 2022, 10:22 pm

Did you cc the chambers on the D0VE's? Looks like the dynamic compression is right at 9.0/1 with that F-46 cam with 10/1 as a base. You will loose your quench pad also with the big Dish pistons. 193 Psi cranking compression. I think it will likely be ok and you will squeak by with some 92.

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