Greenbean - The 98GT - turbo 460 swap

Man, I almost feel like I am drowning in options and I can't figure out the best way to proceed.

I think I have chased the Mass-Flo rabbit as far as I am willing to go. The idea of it is great. The application of it in this particular car is likely not so great. I feel like the hoops I will have to jump through to use it will be more trouble than using the EEC-V and harness that it is already in the car.

Hoops:
1. Extracting EEC-V harness - sounds easy, but it seems there are other non-engine stuff is incorporated into that harness. I *could* leave it in place but I would still have to figure out how to get the EEC-IV harness through the firewall and into the car.
2. Identifying and making stuff work that are contained in that harness.
3. Relocate alternator or convert Mass-Flo EEC-IV to EDIS8. The EEC-V has EDIS built in, so I would really just be adding parts to have a feature I already have access to with the V. Either way I have to make a 36-1 wheel and crank sensor mount. Relocating the alternator is proving to be a much harder task than it sounds. The mounting depth of just about any alternator is the sticking point. I could probably put an old style externally regulated one in there and it would fit, but I feel like that would be going backwards.

Bottom line is: I really want this thing to work like a 1998 Mustang should with no weirdness or quirkiness and I don't think the Mass-Flow EEC-IV can do that for me. If this was originally a carbureted car, it would be a perfect match, but I don't think it is a feasible option for this 98. I will use the intake, injectors, rails, throttle body, mass air meter, carb hat, and Optishift, but I think I will save the ecu, and harness for something else.

As I type this, I just happen to know of a certain red 1983 carbureted turbo car that I could use it on at some point maybe...... haha.

How about one of the cam sync’s that go in place of the distributor? They are very small but I don’t know if they will replace a 36-1 crank pickup.

Duplicate

How about one of the cam sync’s that go in place of the distributor? They are very small but I don’t know if they will replace a 36-1 crank pickup.

You can pinion mount the alternator on the rear-end like the Nascar guys. I dont think the kits are all t hat expensive for a 9 in. Not sure about 8.8 . You could probably fabricate one fairly easy.

wickettoby1 wrote:How about one of the cam sync’s that go in place of the distributor? They are very small but I don’t know if they will replace a 36-1 crank pickup.

In an EEC-IV or EEC-V, the cam sync is only used to enable sequential injection.  I have already made the cam position sensor.  The crank mounted 36-1 is only used for the ignition events.   The 36-1 is not hard to make.  I made one for my 552 that is now in the 73 truck.  

F3 chip. Contains the tune.



I bought a Jaybird from Moates.  It is a little read/write device for the F3 chips that actually contain your tune.  Then you plug the F3 into the J7 port on the ecu.  I read the tune off the Mass-flo F3and saved it to the computer.  I can use the same chip in the EEC-V once I have created a new startup tune.

It's torque converter day!

The converter for the 83GT arrived today as well as the one for Greenbean! This one has been on back order for nearly a month! It is still a lockup converter so a big girl, but it is rated at 2800-3200 stall. Should work fine with a mild 460 and

It is so new it still smells like spray paint. haha.

I took a few minutes yesterday to make the 36-1 crank position sensor wheel for the 460. I made this one the same way I made the one for the yellow truck. I basically just screwed it to of a block of wood and used a hole saw to make the center hole large enough to fit the hatchet spacer for the 460.

Next I will make a mount for the sensor and then index the wheel and weld it to the hatchet spacer.

I made the sensor mounting bracket today. It took me forever to decide where I wanted to put it. It is not nearly as easy to mount as the hall sensor on Nanner was. It is oddly shaped and getting it tucked in, the right distance from the wheel and out of the hatchet spacer's path was somewhat challenging.

I suppose it turned out ok. The wheel is a skosh off-center, but I think the gap, while obviously inconsistent, is within the spec of 0.5mm to 1.5mm. if it gives me trouble. I'll just make another one.

I finally pulled the heads out of the purple power bath they have been soaking in for a month or longer. They cleaned up real nice with the pressure washer.



I started taking the 460 apart. Timing cover is off, cam is out, pan is off, oil pump is off. I pulled 2 rod caps and the bearings are meh, but the crank look ok. I've seen better, but I have certainly run worse. The 302's crank in the 83GT is an example of that. lol. Bearings are standard size and the crank mic's 2.4999, so I figure it'll be fine.



I ordered engine bearings and a gasket kit today. So once I get everything cleaned up, I will be able to assemble the short block. Then it's only a camshaft, lifters and valve springs away from a finished engine!

I am going to use a hyd flat tappet cam in this engine too. I want it to be kinda rowdy so I am thinking a Lunati 10340705. 241/249 at 50, 284/292 advertised, 0.582/.600 on a 110 lsa.

This engine with stock heads will be 10:1. If I went to an aftermarket head later like a TFS, it would be 11.8:1, just like my old 545 was.

Block is clean-er. I hosed it down with degreaser and then hit it with the pressure washer. Now I can do some more work to it without getting greasy goo all over me.

Phooey. I was installing pistons on rods Saturday and broke a piston. I have pressed pins into pistons on many occasions with ZERO problems. This time however was a problem. Haha. Actually, I started out heating the rod end with a propane torch. This being the first piston, I did not heat it long enough so the pin did not slip all the way through the rod. "No problem" I thought, "I can just finish it in the press." Took it back to the press, rigged it up and started pressing it in. It started smoothly with minimal effort, but then the effort increased as the sharp edge of the pin snagged on the opposing pin bore. *POP" Broke it. Dang. That suuuuuuuuccccccccckkkkkkkkksssssssss.

Had I chamfered the outside lip of the pin, it probably would have been fine, but the sharp edge pin and sharp edge pin bore left little room for error.

For the remaining 7, I heated the rod ends for about 7 minutes and they slipped right together very easily. A $75 (the cost of a single KB137 piston - already ordered) lesson learned.

Plot twist. I might be using the efi 460 heads after all. lol

Here's why. Judd has it in his head that he wants to build a big block by himself, fund it himself and ultimately find a cheap car to plop it into himself. He is on a budget so I am donating my other short block 460, the original one from the F250, to him. Of course he will need some heads. I was planning to use the D3's that were on that engine for this 460 I am building for Greenbean, but we made a deal yesterday. I told him if he would go in halfsies with me on a set of Price Motorsport intake adapters, he could have the D3's and I would use the efi heads. This is good because I *really* wanted to use the efi heads on this car but just could not justify the cost of the adapters. Adapting the headers won't be any trouble at all.

I told Judd to make a list of parts and prices etc so he can get a better idea if what he is getting into and so I can watch for any glaring problems. He has been a little surprised at how much performance stuff costs. I really tried to convince him to do a 351w because they will fit in a lot more vehicles, but he is set on doing a 460. Ok by me. I will probably donate a set of Ford Motorsport valve covers, my C6 and a torque converter to his project as well.

I file fit the rings and installed them on the pistons. It went pretty quick. I went slow on the first one and counted the turns on the ring grinder. That got me ball park real quick for the remaining 7. I gapped them a little larger in the event I ever want to throw a little nitrous at it.

Short block is done. It's not perfect, but I didn't expect it to be. It is better than it was though.

I pressure washed most off the goo off the heads and the cut the guides for more lift and better seals. Then I put the heads into my Purple Power tub for a soak. I also cleaned up the oil pan and rolled the car out to wash the engine bay.

Yesterday I called Price Motorsport to order the adapters and wow, they are great. I believe I spoke with Mary and to say she knew what she was talking about is an understatement. She knows all the questions to ask and is a treat to talk with. I kinda got lucky with my order because she said they were just finishing a run of the adapters and all were pre-sold except one!

Love following this build !! cant wait to see her done !!

The rusty block was driving me nuts, so I went ahead and painted it. I couldn't decide what color then I saw a pic of the original 545 I built for the 83GT back in 2010. It just looked right, so knew I had to go with blue over gray or black. I shot the pan with black and the valve covers will also be black. 

The Price Motorsport intake adapters arrived this morning. I didn't even know they shipped. haha. They are nice looking, well thought out parts. Can't wait to see how they look on the engine.

The valley plate attaches uses existing holes that need to be tapped 1/4" NC.

Valve cleaning day. I did the valves from both sets of heads. This is a valve from the D3 heads. They were fairly gunked up. The valves from the efi heads were MUCH cleaner. They all turned out pretty nice though. I use brake clean, fine emery cloth, and scotch brite to clean them. Oh and a flat tip screwdriver to initially knock the worst of it off.

Wow these things fit nice! The intake port sorta bulges in a tiny bit on the inside turn side, so I might take a carbide and match the head and also clean up the ridge in the bowls up near the intake valve seats. That will likely be the extent of the porting I do to these. These heads have very little guide boss intrusion and the casting in the port is very smooth.

Heads are just about ready for assembly. I matched the intake ports to the Price Motorsport intake adapter plates and cleaned up the bowls a bit. Next job is lapping the valves then checking piston to valve clearance. I think it will have plenty, but I always check. Once bit, twice shy!



I drilled and tapped the existing holes in the china wall that will secure the valley plate. It went really well but I wish I had a bottoming tap to get the threads a little deeper. Now that I think about it, I might grind the pointy tip off my tap to allow for deeper threading.

I also dumped the locks and retainers in the naptha tank so they can start soaking. I'll scrub them after a couple of days and then they will be ready for assembly.

Heads are assembled except for cylinder #1. I will use it to check piston to valve clearance. Springs are TFS 16514's . They are the same spring I am running on the truck even though this cam has a little more lift. I checked retainer to seal clearance and I am good to 0.715" lift which is way more than this cam has. Installed height is 1.80" best I can measure.

I set the heads, intake adapters, intake and valve covers on see what it is going to look like. 


​I took a pic down in the intake port and they look like they will match up nicely once the intake gaskets are in place.

Looking Good!!

Cleaned rockers, pedestals, pushrods and bolts this evening. Cleaning stuff sucks. It's much more fun to use brand new, shiny parts.

BigBlockRanger wrote:Cleaned rockers, pedestals, pushrods and bolts this evening. Cleaning stuff sucks. It's much more fun to use brand new, shiny parts.

I agree the cleaning part sucks I don't mind rebuilding a engine just hate all the cleaning that goes with it

Piston to valve clearance checked out good. The valves barely touched the clay so I didn't even bother to measure it. With that checking out, I went ahead and installed the heads.

I installed an intake rocker and exhaust rocker and checked the lifter preload. Both looked good. Exhaust *might* could stand a little more, but I figure it will be fine.

I also started painting the headers with high temp bbq paint. They are looking pretty good.

I installed the Price Motorsport intake adapter kit and bolted on the intake. It all fit like a glove. It's nice when aftermarket parts fit exactly like they are supposed to!

I also jammed the cam position sensor in it mostly just to fill the hole. I was concerned that it might hit the raised intake, but it fits real good.