Need help---starter problems---460 to Powerglide trans.

Ok---so first let me give you as much info as I can----as I realize that the quality of answers I am given will depend on the info I give out.

I have a A460 block mated to a ATI Powerglide transmission with the 460 bellhousing. Because of this I am not running an adaptor plate.

I continue to have starter problems, where the starter does not engage properly, so I am starting from square one to diagnose the problem. I am running an ATI flexplate, and I checked and confirmed I installed the flexplate with the side marked "engine side" towards the engine. Up until this point, I also assumed that I installed the crank / flexplate adaptor ring correctly, because when I bolted up the trans, the converter pads where about 1/8" from the flexplate, very close but it rotated freely. I installed the adaptor ring to the crank, with flexplate on top, then converter--see picture below, is this correct?

But, when I took off the starter, the way it is engaging the flexplate, it looks like the flexplate is too far away from the engine. Only a small part of the starter is engaging to the leading edge of the flexplate---see picture below. This would seem to suggest to me the flexplate needs to be closer to the engine---if I put the flexplate on first, then the adaptor ring, it looks like this problem would be solved---but then the converter pads would be too far away--and when I bolt it up to the flexplate it would pull the converter away from the pump engagment. I hope I am making sense here.

So based on the pictures below, and what I described above, did I install the adaptor ring wrong or is there another issue here?

richter69 wrote:ditch that starter and and go down to the chain parts store..............get a 49.95 starter from like a 95 F250 auto trans..............I bet she will be fine........

For reference get the distance from the surface where the starter bolts up to the leading edge of the fw.



on second thought you say there is no plate between the block and bell? they just mate to one another?

i just called all 3 parts store and there is no 50 dollar starter Jon ....whats the secret .....(134-150 plus 34 doll core )


sorry to hijack your thread

Try taking the shim out of that starter that should help. How much clearance now when the starter is disengaged?

dkp

It may be more of a "how deep are the teeth meshing" deal than the gear not coming out far enough. Meaning only the very outer edges of the teeth are engaging eah other.

richter69 wrote:ditch that starter and and go down to the chain parts store..............get a 49.95 starter from like a 95 F250 auto trans..............I bet she will be fine........

For reference get the distance from the surface where the starter bolts up to the leading edge of the fw.

on second thought you say there is no plate between the block and bell? they just mate to one another?

If so this could be your depth issue.......I use a .100 thick midplate and the starter bolts directly to the bell............but it seems even with half a width of the fp it would still crank over fine.

I have to stick to a mini starter that I can rotate because of the headers. My starter bolts directly to the bellhousing also---but I am not running a midplate as I have the ATI 460 bell that bolts to the PowerGlide supercase. Since the starter bolts directly to the bell, anything that pushes the bell back would help--as it looks like the starter is engaging only the front half of the flexplate.

bosshoss wrote:Try taking the shim out of that starter that should help. How much clearance now when the starter is disengaged?

dkp

I don't know--I will measure.

BigDave65 wrote:It may be more of a "how deep are the teeth meshing" deal than the gear not coming out far enough. Meaning only the very outer edges of the teeth are engaging eah other.

Yeah--thats what it looks like--the starter gears are damaged only on the tip, and the flexplate--the ring gear itself is not damaged, just the black paint is removed. It seems like the gears are not deep enough--like you say--but I have no idea how to fix that other then try another starter.

can you take measurment from the starter mounting on the bell to the flexplate front side plus the width of the teeth. then put starter in a vice or clamp it down and put 12 volts to it an measure starter mounting face lip with bolt hole. u can run the the for along time so you can measure. see if the starter will extend the starter drive enough.

To fix the very same problem on my JW bellhousing, I slotted the bottom hole of the mounting plate on a milling machine, to rotate the starter into the flywheel about an 1/8". The trick to making this work is when you push the starter over, you have to place a small piece of wire or something into the hole, the same thickness of the mounting flange or a little less, to keep it from sliding back when you start cranking on it.

This may sound a little crazy but it works perfect for me.

richter69 wrote:shit must be higher in Alabama.

I got mine for free....they were cleaning out old stock in the parts dept one day...........these be "Fred Jones" starters..............Lem knows lol.

D B Electric sells them for $42.95.

Lem Evans wrote:

richter69 wrote:shit must be higher in Alabama.

I got mine for free....they were cleaning out old stock in the parts dept one day...........these be "Fred Jones" starters..............Lem knows lol.

D B Electric sells them for $42.95.

Thats where I bought mine from and have never had a problem with it but my compression is only 12.5 but will spin the engine good. Jim

psfracer wrote:if I put the flexplate on first, then the adaptor ring, it looks like this problem would be solved---but then the converter pads would be too far away--and when I bolt it up to the flexplate it would pull the converter away from the pump engagment.

I would go this route and put some shims between the converter pads and the flexplate. A couple of hardened washers will do the trick.

Lem Evans wrote:

richter69 wrote:shit must be higher in Alabama.

I got mine for free....they were cleaning out old stock in the parts dept one day...........these be "Fred Jones" starters..............Lem knows lol.

D B Electric sells them for $42.95.

http://www.dbelectrical.com/c-1687-75-liter.aspx